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MadskpGOLD Memberso how about a new thread title of ‘BeoLink Converter 1611 Innovative Configurations’?
Done now!
Great 🙂 Now we can really widen the scope of this thread 😉
Joke aside, one thing we haven’t discussed about the use of the 1611 in this thread is how it could be used with a Beosound with Masterlink. It would probably give an extra aux input with a video command. But could it also give an extra sound input, or will the Beosound just open it’s integrated aux input regardless of audio command that is not integrated for example N.music?
Location: DenmarkMadskpGOLD MemberSo got the transistor. I ended up buying BC807-25 instead of BC808-25 (they have alomost identical data) as it was easier to come by.
desoldered the old TR13 with hot air, and soldered in the new one.
Testing and red light turns on in the IR eye. Meassuring with multimeter shows 5.46V so very close to the specified 5.5V.
So now I just need one Bench supply for it until I find a 15V power brick.
unfortnuatly the ribbon cable to the PL connectors broke of in the proces so need some extra repair work before its ready for further testing
Location: DenmarkMadskpGOLD MemberMute button on IR eye still has no function (but LED turns on and off) no long press standby, so I might have a defect somewhere.
I have noticed strange physical mute button (and light) behaviour so I don’t think it’s a fault. I also had different behaviour between Type 2020 and Type 2023 so that confused me further. If I do further testing of MUTE and LED I will stick with the earlier Type 2020 to try to find results consistent with yours.
Good to know that not nesecarily broken. For good meassure I will try to make a MCL cable and hook the MCL2AV up to my BM5500 to see if everything works as expected there.
just found a bag with MCL cable and speakerlink connectors in my storage today. Also in the bag was an extra IR eye of the same tape as used with the MCL2AV just wired up with a minijack from when I used it with a Beoport many years ago. Made me remember that it came from a MCL2AV I had over 20 years ago, but didn’t know how to use at that time, so it probably ended up as E waste ?
Location: DenmarkMadskpGOLD MemberGuy Wrote:@Guy: One thing I don’t think you have tested is how the reaction to an AV + Video source command is from the BL3500 when connected to the 1611 and MCL2AV? Does it just open the video source on the 1611?
Just tried that now (with no IR sensor on MCL2AV): BL3500 in Option 2 or 6: Behaves exactly as when selecting TV etc without AV first. Just opens the video source on the 1611. BL3500 in Option 1 or 5: You need to press AV first to open video source on the 1611. (Hence behaves just like most audiomasters in Opt 1) In both case above, if listening to video source, then pressing SHIFT RADO 6/7 or any audio source causes BL3500 to switch off.
Thanks for testing this. So the fifth audio input for the BL3500 is not an option. Might also have been overkill ?
Location: DenmarkMadskpGOLD Member@Guy: One thing I don’t think you have tested is how the reaction to an AV + Video source command is from the BL3500 when connected to the 1611 and MCL2AV? Does it just open the video source on the 1611?
The reason for asking this is that I got an idea the the cable connected to the AUX port on the MCL2AV could be split up in an output (pin 1, 2, 4 and 6) to the 1611 and an extra input input (pin 2, 3, 5) which could be selected with the AV + video source command. I will also try to test this in my setup with the BC6 when I has some test time again
Location: DenmarkMadskpGOLD MemberGot time for some more testing today before i began the repair on the MCL 2AV.
I think it has been mentioned before that my MCL2AV is a type 2020, but there is no sticker with the SW version. Only sticker I could find is on the Eprom.
Before I began my testing i made a reset of settings on the BC6 from the service menu as I was nervous that there could be unwanted settings made through the years that could affect the tests. For example both the analog and Digital TV tuner had been disabled.
MCL2AV stand alone option 1.5 and 2.5 + IR eye + PL speakers + BC3500 + iphone on CD input
I started with the MCL2AV in stand alone mode to confirm that things worked as expected. In both option settings 1.5 and 2.5 selection of both CD and tape input worked as expected with shift+radio+6/7 commands. And tape command was working when BC3500 was connected. When in option 1.5 AV + Video source command opens the Aux input. from all inputs music playing on speakers connected to the PL ports.
BC6 opt. 2 +1611 + MCL2AV opt 2.5 +IR eye + PL speakers + BC3500 + Iphone on CD input. All in same room
IR eye on MCL2AV will not react at all to IR commands even when blocking the IR on BC6. It seems like it’s disabled, so all IR is through the BC6
Mute button on IR eye has no function (but LED turns on and off), no long press standby
Full control of BC3500 with tape commands.
Cd input starts up with shift + Radio + 7 without problem
AV + Video Source just changes to that video source on the TV. No sound on MCL2AV PL speakers. In fact all the time in this scenario only very faint sound would come out of the PL speaker output on MCL2AV event when turning the volume up on the conencted computer speakers.
BC6 opt. 2 +1611 + MCL2AV opt 1.5 +IR eye + PL speakers + BC3500 + Iphone on CD input. All in same room but should be in 2 rooms in a real case scenario
Ir eye i functioning on the MCL2 AV, so had to block the IR sensor that I didn’t want tor receive the signals in this test.
Mute button on IR eye still has no function (but LED turns on and off) no long press standby, so I might have a defect somewhere.
Mute and volume control with remote works independently for
Full control of BC3500 from both MCL2AV and BC6, Start/stop and FF/RW affects both sources (stop in one room stop for all rooms etc.)
Cd input starts up independently on both sources with shift + Radio + 7
Sound is comming out of PL speaker output on MCL2AV
AV + Video Source command moves sound from BC6 video source to MCL2AV speakers, but not back when pressed once more. Can only go away with standby or choosing another source.
Short press standby when pointing at the BC6 IR sensor only turns off TV. For the MCL2AV a short press turns off MCL2 AV, but not TV. A long press pointing at the BC6 will turn off both devices.
So thats it for todays testing. I think the results are getting more stable, when you know what to expect, and I can see a use for both of the tested cases here either in the same room for the first one or i separate rooms for the second one.
Location: DenmarkMadskpGOLD MemberWhen playing from the MCL2AV sources (TAPE and CD) the TV menu showed only A.AUX (with either MCL2AV type).
Ok interesting when it doesn’t show up on my BC6, but of course the BV10 is newer. But My BC6 also has some weird things going on once in a while, so i might just reset it to factory defaults to be sure that Im getting “clean” results from my testing.
I could also control and listen to the TV from the MCL2AV/BL1611 ‘link room’ by pressing AV TV, but couldn’t listen to any of the TV’s hdmi inputs (eg by pressing AV SAT). After trying to do so, I had to switch the system off and on again to control/hear normal TV.
If I remember correctly HDMI sources (or digital sources) can not be distributed via Masterlink, so that may be the reason for that behaviour). My BC6 doesn’t have HDMI, so I might not be able to make a comparing test.
Location: DenmarkMadskpGOLD MemberYes this would be useful. Matador produced an excellent diagram that summarised the early breakthrough with the ‘dual input’ BL1611 to BeoLab 3500. When we have finished playing with the ‘added MCL2AV’ we probably need something similar to summarise the one-room/two-room configurations with TV or BL3500 connected. Perhaps when the Beoworld User/Service Manuals library has been re-vamped we could ask for a ‘Novel Configurations’ folder where we store such information?
Yes it was actually something like that I thought, placing them in the new manual library might also have the benefit the Keith doesn’t have to make a whole new “module” for it. Looking at Matadors diagram again, most things are mentioned so it’s a great format. Maybe just adding a few disclamers about what might not work for the different use cases, and for what MK and SW version the setup has been tested, and maybe a link to the thread were the info originates from.
I for one would be willing to put in some hours to make some of these configuration pages.
Location: DenmarkMadskpGOLD MemberHi there, I suggest we rename the topics since it is now far from BL3500 and 1611 only. It would help people to find information about all your experiments. Being not good at naming threads, you can suggest anything that would be relevant. Guy, fell free to rename it if I’m not around. Regards.
Yeah we got arround a lot of setups in this thread. Maybe something like “B&O black boxes unofficial use cases” 🙂
But yes this thread is lenghty and it can be hard for newcommers to fin the info. Maybe we can edit some of the important posts with relevant info tags
Another thought with the current situation for Beoworld, and idea could be to make some one or two pagers with a simple info drawing and a short description of the usecases we found in the thread that could be made available to Gold members as and added bonus? This could be true for other threads also. just a thought
Location: DenmarkMadskpGOLD MemberSo the addition of the MCL2AV allows you to have a total of three selectable inputs from the BL3500.
Plus the one from the PL socket on the BL3500 MK2 with the special key combination. Don’t remember if we ever established if this input also will work in some form with the MK1 version with the MCL socket?
Location: DenmarkMadskpGOLD Memberand maybe some kind of add’s even though its wonderfull with a part of the internet without it. But if that can keep the boat floating im fine with it.
An option for add’s could also be that paying members would not see the add’s
Location: DenmarkMadskpGOLD MemberBL3500 in L.OPT 1, 2, 5 or 6/MCL2AV in L.OPT 2.5 or 2.6 I can select and play SHIFT RADIO 6 from the BL3500 room (this doesn’t start the PL speakers connected to the MCL2AV).
If you had and Audio master instead of the MCL2AV I guess you would have the same behaviour when you start the music from a link room.
However, after selecting/controlling the BL3500 I cannot then select or control anything within the MCL2AV room. Even Mute or Volume don’t work, even though the IR receive LED is flashing on the MCL2AV’s IR sensor. Also the IR sensor MUTE button has no response. The MCL2AV room will only work again if I turn the system off and re-set the MCL2AV option settings.
However this doesn’t sound like something that would happen with an audiomaster.
BL3500 in L.OPT 1, 2, 5 or 6/MCL2AV in L.OPT 1.5 or 1.6 Independent control in both rooms is possible (has to be same MCL2AV source in each room). Can switch on (or mute) independently from either room, and ‘join’ by pressing just vol or mute in MCL2AV room (but you have to press the full SHIFT RADIO 6 to ‘join’ in the BL3500 room). The MCL2AV IR sensor’s MUTE switch works to join or mute once sound is already playing in the BL3500 room. A good useable outcome!
This sound like a great use case, especially if you have a datalink compatible unit, and also want other sources connected. The Beolab 3500 should still be able to access the Video source in the 1611 I guess?
If the MCL2AV/BL1611 combination is in the same room as another ML device (with a built-in IR sensor), disconnecting the IR sensor from the MCL2AV simplifies control. Unfortunately, you cannot then activate any PL speakers connected to the MCL2AV.
If used with a Beolab 3500 or a TV with speakers (internal or external) I dont see much use for the PL port in the same room, so this might be ok.
I will be interested to see if similar results are obtained with a BeoVision instead of the BL3500.
I will for sure be looking in to this and report back
Guy wrote:
Anyway, enough for today – apparently the ML cable across the landing is a ‘trip hazard’ and the BeoLab 3500 needs moving from our bed!Hehe, yes it’s not always easy to make these experiments when you have other people in the house. My setup is in an attic room where I can just let it be when I’m finished without worrying about anyone tripping. only downside is that the access is through the room where our little boy is sleeping which makes experimenting in the evening hours not an option.
Location: DenmarkMadskpGOLD MemberIf you use the TV to select the MCL2AV’s TAPE input using SHIFT MENU 6, and then press MENU to turn on the TV screen, does it show that the TV is receiving an A.AUX source or A.TAPE source?
Had a little time for testing this today. tried it with different setups and commands:
BC6 opt. 2 +1611 + iphone
Activating with audio command (Radio/CD/A.tape). No text on tv about source. Menu can be selected, but source is not in the headline of the menu as it is for the video sources.
BC6 opt. 2 +1611 + MCL2AV opt. 2.5 + iphone
Activating with Shift + Radio + 6 command. No text on tv about source. Menu can be selected, but source is not in the headline of the menu as it is for the video sources.
BC6 opt. 2 +1611 + MCL2AV opt 2.5 + BC3500.
Activating with A.tape command. No text on tv about source. Menu can be selected, but source is not in the headline of the menu as it is for the video sources.
So at least for my setup the TV won’t show the audio source. Don’t know if it’s different with a proper audiomaster connencted.
BL3500 in L.OPT 1, 2, 5 or 6/MCL2AV in L.OPT 0 BL3500 plays TAPE input sound whatever audio source is selected on remote – there is no separate selection/control of TAPE or CD inputs.
BC6 opt. 2 +1611 + MCL2AV opt 0 + BC3500.
No control of BC3500, and music started manually on the BC3500’s button music is playing regardless which audio command I use to activate the BC6 (A.tape/cd/radio/shift+Radio 6 or 7), so sounds like some of the same behaviour you are experiencing.
Looking at the MCL2 handbook, option 0 is mentioned for the MCL2AV, but no use case is mentioned. Our experiments seems to show that it just opens the audio ports and passes sound through in this option setting.
Location: DenmarkMadskpGOLD MemberHello Lee. I have been a Gold member at least since 2009 acording to my mail history, but probably longer since I switched Email provider at one point. But have been looking arround Beoworld since the early days. Don’t remember why I started being a gold member, but for one thing I think the price draw was a tipping point at that time, and I also won two times some years back.
Now however the prize draw is not the main point for me. I just want to support the site, and all the work that’s being done to keep it running. Thanks Keith.
A bonus is of course acces to the user and service manuals which is gold worth for people who are reparing and/or tinkering with B&O gear, and as a mean to get some og the threads running.
I can however see how people who come with a specific question for example regarding cabling to get their equipment runnning, and then dont need more information, because their setup just works, dont see the benefit for the gold membership.
Reduction of prize draws is fine with me. The number of prizes per draw could also be limited to maybe one. The chances of winning is still high. At the very end you should not pay for it yourself.
Other than that i think as other also has suggested that more visibility about the benefits of gold member ship on the front page, and a more visible donation button, and maybe some kind of add’s even though its wonderfull with a part of the internet without it. But if that can keep the boat floating im fine with it.
Location: DenmarkMadskpGOLD MemberWhilst thinking about the OneRemote, I did revisit the MCL2AV circuit diagram: I think we have noted before that the diagram is incorrect: it shows TAPE and CD datalink wired to pin 6, when it must actually be to pin 7. For the AUX input, the AAL is correctly shown to pin 6.
I am aware of this and think it just might be an error on the diagram, both because the Beocord 3500. works as it should and also because it wouldn’t make much sense.
You may have finished testing now so I could be too late! I’d be interested to hear how your setup behaves with the IR sensor removed from the MCL2AV. Or in two-rooms if you have a long enough ML cable! If you use the TV to select the MCL2AV’s TAPE input using SHIFT MENU 6, and then press MENU to turn on the TV screen, does it show that the TV is receiving an A.AUX source or A.TAPE source?
Actually I haven’t had the time for further testing. I have another project in my House that takes longer than expected (these kind of things always take longer that you like to think 🙂 ), and the yesterday i had planned to make a longer ML cable, but then realised that my plan to extend it with network cable wouldn’t work because it needs to have 9 wires (or 8 and a shield), and I dont have that available.
But form some of the tests I already have performed I can tell you that the TV wouldn’t show the menu (our the source when activating it), so I haven’t been able to see what source it actually was on the TV. I don’t remember if this is also the case with only the 1611 connected to the TV, but I will test both scenarios next time I work on it and report back. I will also test the Beaviour without the IR sensor (and in another room when I get a longer ML cable)
Location: DenmarkMadskpGOLD MemberFirst, great testing notes even though the results may be disapointing for now.Basically with the BL3500 in L.OPT 1, 2, 5 or 6 it was possible to use SHIFT RADIO 6 or 7 to select correct MCL2AV input (TAPE or CD). It was not possible to select these inputs directly using CD or TAPE on the remote. EDIT: Input selection via the BL3500 did not switch on the PL speaker attached to the MCL2AV.
I had some thoughts about this input selection, and it ocured to me that when the MCL2AV is used in a MCL system it will allways have an audio master with the CD and A.Tape sources available (even if nothing is connected to those connections on the Audiomaster). Therfore the MCL2AV has to register if a Datalink device is available locally, and if not it should use the Audiomaster’s source instead. This might explain the Behaviour we are seeing.
Guy wrote:
So I think that the MCL2AV doesn’t recognise the OneRemote radio as ‘proper’ Datalink and therefore won’t keep the TAPE (or CD) input open – the data receive light on the OneRemote flashes randomly even when MCL2AV is at stand-by, as if it is being interrogated and failing!But weird that the OneRemote radio wont work the proper way here when it is working in other situations.
EDIT: Input selection via the BL3500 did not switch on the PL speaker attached to the MCL2AV.
I think one of the paragraphs about option settings mentions that option 2 is used when the TV (in your case the BL3500) reproduces all the sounds, and after that there is the note about defaulting to option 2 when no IR eye is connected.
Next I tried numerous combinations of L.OPTs on both MCL2AV and BL3500. Basically I was trying to select the TAPE and CD inputs from the BL3500 using SHIFT RADIO 6 and 7. This resulted in lots of system lockups during testing, even when I tried the MCL2AV in L.OPT 0. Although it sometimes worked as expected there was no consistency of results and it became very frustrating! I often had to unplug/power-down everything to clear the system. I was using all the eqpt in one room, shielding IR sensors when inputting Option settings to a single device.
It would seems as the 2 IR sensors introduce some kind of confussion in the system. But then again this was probably inteded to be used with either the IR sensor or the TV’s IR eye.
I will see if I can get on with my testing tomorrow. Let me know if there are situations you like to have tested with the Beocord 3500 on datalink
Location: DenmarkMadskpGOLD MemberI think I will also use a longer ML cable to put one of the devices in a separate room. I think that I will need to do this because using L.OPT 0 (IR-off) or L.OPT 4 (link-only) may change other behaviour.
I’am also thinking that maybe I should make an extension for my 1.5m ML Y cable just to be able to get distance between the IR receivers.
I’ll also try the OneRemote Radio and my DVD1 with modified SCART to Aux cable as inputs into the MCL2AV to see if they can be controlled either directly or via the BL1611/BL3500.
I think you already tried the DVD1 with the MCL2AV in this thread https://archivedforum2.beoworld.org/forums/p/45162/327485.aspx#327485, and on the Aux port of your BC9500. In both cases it’s is Audio Aux Link, so it might be communicating with that which makes sense as its a video product and should use Audio link. However as fas as I can see you didn’t have luck controlling it via direct connection with the 1611 here https://forum.beoworld.org/forums/topic/beolab-3500-and-1611-converter-settings/page/8/#post-14333
Could be fun to see if the Shift + Radio + 4 command is activating it on the MCL2AV’s Aux port though.
Good luck with the BeoSound 1 test!
Thanks. Did try it today, but no luck, no control of the Beocord 3500, even though the command is A.MEM from the remote to activate the Aux of the BS1. It might be that the BS1 was just over engineered hardware wise, but never got the proper software to support this hardware.
Location: DenmarkMadskpGOLD MemberGreat to hear. Allways better with som ping pong about it.The next thing I noticed is that the MCL2 Handbook has the SHIFT RADIO 6 and SHIFT RADIO 7 the wrong way around. SHIFT RADIO 6 is the TAPE input and SHIFT RADIO 7 is CD.
Ok, didn’t notice that, but it is also correct stated in the MCL user manual, so that must have been there I noted it in the first place. Btw. do you remember what commands you used when you had the stand alone stup with your computer? Was it the same you used?
I too have already experienced this from both CD and A.TAPE. It seems as if the MCL2AV will play it for a while until is realises that there is no datalink-compatible product connected.
Somehow glad to hear that you have the same experience. I was beginning to think if my MCL2AV had other defects than the one in the power circuit. It may be that it is waiting for some kind of handshake with the datalink source. Could also be related to the MCP comptability where it needs some information back to the remote.
I didn’t get to test anything today, but I started up on a preview for test scheme in a spreadsheet. I attached it to this post. There are many combinations with the different options, but some may be ruled out beforehand as no go. I am open for inputs and corrections.
For one thing I didn’t take the link option 6 in it as it seems to have something to do with VCR in the main room.
I probably won’t make any tests on this setup tomorrow as I go to visit my parents. But that also means I get to test the Beocord 3500 with their Beosound 1 to see if there is any hidden link capability there. If there is I will start a new thread on that subject.
Location: DenmarkMadskpGOLD MemberI think that would be the case depending on your setup and goal. My knowledge of the ML/NL converter is limited, so my answer is for the ML part.
in the linked thread it was tested with both Beolab 2000 and 3500 as well as different Beovisions and a Beport without other components in the Masterlink chain.
Location: DenmarkMadskpGOLD MemberTodays testing was with mixed results
I have read up on the option settings in the Masterlink handbook, both the older one called System Manual 89 90 Master Control Link 2, and the newer Master Control Link handbook.
Did you try various option settings? I see from the MCL Handbook that older versions of the MCL2AV have double option settings: You set L.OPT 0, 1 or 2 and then L.OPT 5 of 6 in addition. These are then expressed in the manual as L.OPT 1.5 etc, with factory (default) being L.OPT 2.5.
This was only mentioned in the older of the 2 manuals. In the newer one option programming of MCL2AV wasn’t even mentioned, even though it is shown in setups with af TV. But i might be because the Option 2.5 covers most use cases as it also defaults to option 2 when the IR eye is not present (which might be true in many cases when a TV is also present in the same room).
I tried a little back and forth with option settings with mixed results. I think I will have to to a more controlled testing where I take notes for the different scenarios.
What I really cant figure is if the TV should have option 5 as a Link TV or option 2, as it’s not a link TV in this setup. I haven’t had any luck with the TV in option 1. It seems like I loose all control, but will try it again in next test being sure that both the MCL2AV and the TV is in option 1.
I am not sure how relevant it is, but the ‘SHIFT RADIO’ followed by a number (or AUX followed by a number), is also used by other B&O eqpt to select various aux inputs. For instance, or my BC9500 I can select the following from its front panel: AUX 1 – TV AUX 2 – V.TAPE AUX 3 – SAT (or DTV) AUX 4 – CDV (or DVD) AUX 5 – V.TAPE.2 AUX 8 – MICROPHONE
It’s highly relevant. In one of my test’s today (dont remember the option settings, have to take notes) I could use AV + TV to turn on the PL output of the MCL2AV and Shift + Radio + 7 to switch back to sound on only TV.
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