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Reply to @Martin01
Within the Emerge Connectivity Tech Specs… “Digital Power Link (up to 24 bit / 48 kHz)”
My question is why have Bang & Olufsen effectively lost confidence in the Theatre’s surround performance. With the use of the virtual speakers you can obtain a 7.0.4 system from the sound bar without the need to add any extra physical speakers. The sound is impressive and shouldn’t need the support of extra speakers turning it into a very expensive centre speaker.
I get if DPL could be used with a Stage as that is a 3.0 system to give it the ability to become a larger system and use its capability to receive Atmos (and then downmix using TrueImage).
I for one am very happy with WiSA, and if I wanted to add non WiSA speakers could with a BeoLab Receiver 1. As it is I have added 4 sets of BeoLab 17s and a BeoLab 19 to my Theatre but only because I do promote the Theatre is even more of a powerhouse with more speakers but I still use the FL, FC, and FR from the bar and use the 17s for Surrounds, Rears and all 4 height channels.
When you say connected are you using PUC to control your Apple TV device and a BR1? As this is working fine for me.
However, I have two other LG TVs one connected to a B&O Stage the other standalone where both LG TV’s are connected to an Apple TV 4K device and also a Sky Q mini box using LG’s simplink (hdmi cec) to control all devices with the LG remote.
Since updating the Apple TV to TVOS 17.4 the hdmi cec no longer works for the Apple TV, but still OK for the Sky Q mini boxes. Only articles I can see online refer to controling devices through cec but with the Apple TV remote not the other way round. I have had to go back to using two remotes for these TVs.
I realised after the latest Theatre update that my TV button was not now set to anything and by default live TV was coming on, on start up when it should be Sky Q. Found that the on start up settings were blank in the app so put back to Sky Q.
Also previously I had my music button set to Apple TV but that now is not an option just Line In or USB.
Adding more speakers keeps enhancing my experience of the Theatre… I went to review the ‘ultimate Dolby Atmos setup’ in the Manchester, UK store. Ian the manager is a friend and I know he is passionate for delivering the best for his existing and new customers.
But he is naughty as his setup beats my LG G3 65” Theatre on a motorised wall bracket with 3 x pairs of BL17s and a BL19 and is food for thought on whether I start again and upgrade…
If you get the chance go and listen and see his…
LG G3 77” Theatre on a motorised floor stand using the FL, FR & C as the Centre; with BL50 as FL & FR, BL28 as either WL/SL & WR/SR; with BL8 as either SL/BL & SR/BR; a BL19; and 2 sets of Celestial each set using a BeoAmp 2 as the four Height speakers.
The sound and picture is so enveloping I can only imagine if in my home and no large airy store to transport me into the movie or stadium or concert hall… in this case using latest technology speakers paired with modern classics ‘more is more and beats all!’
Thank you Ian your store is leading the way to show the art of the possible and Bang & Olufsen’s products at their very best. No doubt I will be handing you my money for years to come… now should I replace again and add the LG G4 because when you tempted me from my G2 bought with the Theatre in October 2022 to replace with a G3 in March 2023 it was itself a step up in the picture to match what will be a giant leap when I talk myself into replacing my BL17s with BL8s and add Celestial heights.
On the website in the design drop down of the Theatre it is still referencing G2, surely it should come with the G3 or even latest G4 when available … assuming it will when bought via a store. In my real world experience the best thing I did was trading up my G2 65 for the G3 65 with MLA… made me fall in love again with movies… excellent Atmos sound & a picture second to none (maybe just to the Sony A95L) but BeoRemote One control made the LG the only choice.
From my audition in store I am surprised to read the bass number. Even more so when compared to BeoLab 17 figures…
Frequency Range
31 – 24,000 Hz
Maximum Loudness @1m (SPL)
106 dB SPL
Bass Capability
90 dB SPLAgree with @Sandyb. I have a Theatre with a G3 and latest ATV. When first installed the HDMIs used by B&O installer despite saying Ultra Fast only provided 4:2:0. The installer swapped for others in his van and now I have 4:4:4. The same with the HDMI to SkyQ 1st set of HDMIs would not give me 2160P 10 bit just 8 bit but again the installer swapped for a different cable and now I have 10 bit with UHD HDR showing on screen when I go to Sky Sports UHD or Sky F1 UHD channel.
Re DV and Atmos message on G3 you will not see Atmos on DV when using ATV 4K box connected to the Theatre as ATV uses Dolby MAT codec. If you open the B&O app and check the signal it will confirm Atmos is being played when the content is outputting an Atmos soundtrack.
Make sure your HDMI cable supports UHD-2 (UHD II) (High Speed with Ethernet designed for eARC) not all 2.1 specification cables do.
In my personal opinion on listening extensively at my dealers and at home to my taste keep the BL19, but change the crossover in the app to 90 kHz. The Theatre shares the bass across all speakers. In your case the 28s will take much of this but by also having the BL19 in another location it adds to the whole room.
I actually trialled 2 x BL19s for a month before the Theatre with an Eclipse and 6 x BL17s but realised the new bass magic of the Theatre I only needed 1 x BL19, but now if the right one came along at the right price I would snap it up I just wasn’t in a position to buy new a year ago.
Try it and if you don’t like or need it sell the BL19, there is an active 2nd hand market for them as the sub is so capable especially with the Theatre as it brings more out of it than I have ever experienced with an Eclipse or Avant.
See my post on another thread > Big Willie Style… sweet spot for bass management crossover for the Theatre with a BeoLab 19.
Big Willie Style… sweet spot for bass management crossover for the Theatre with a BeoLab 19.
I was watching BeoTalk episode 275, and Willie at 7 mins drops in a golden nugget of his learned experience from installing that if you weren’t really listening you would have missed because it was said in his usual throwaway casual style.
Well my ears pricked up and I rushed to pause the podcast and try… the result to my ears this guy knows his stuff!
He is suggesting for small rooms change the crossover frequency in the app from 120 kHz down to 90 kHz and for big rooms to 95 kHz.
https://www.youtube.com/live/eipxSggN9QE?si=eGm8QOSYmh0weYng
I have what I would say is a typical lounge size for a modern 4 bedroom UK house that I would try as ‘small’ and then the ability to open double doors to a dining room where another set of BeoLab 17s live so that listening position to me is ‘large’ and with these lower settings everything just seems better.
Try it… the beauty of a Theatre and with the app you can tune your setup as frequently as you want… or restore to default settings.
For Stereo+ have you ensured in the listen position you have changed the BL8 to ‘Front Left & Right’, by default they are assigned Surround Left + Right and so most focus is on the Theatre. If you only assign FL + FR the sound is balanced.
I have 6 x BL17s and do not feel I need dedicated ceiling speakers because the mic calibration ensures I get the sound ‘virtually’ and it is great enough for the amount of real height effects when compared to the much more used ‘surround and back’ channels.
Try this… When you ran the mic room calibration it will have taken readings for the side and up firing speakers on the Theatre. Change in your setup the side firing to Left & Right Surround Height and ensure the Left & Right Up Firing are set to Left & Right Front Height. This will give you the x.x.4 height speakers.
I auditioned at a store yesterday, the setup was Theatre with BL28 as fronts, BL8 as Surrounds and a BL19 off to the side. I set up these listening positions:
- Theatre on its own [5.0.2] ((using TV sound mode ))
- BL8 on their own (narrow beam) [2.0] ((using Music sound mode))
- Theatre with BL8 (wide beam) [5.0.4] ((using TV sound mode))
- Theatre FL + FR only with BL8 (narrow beam) [2.0] and also with BL19 [2.1] ((using Music sound mode))
- Theatre with BL28 (wide beam) + BL8 (wide beam) + BL19 [7.1.4] ((using Movie sound mode))
The 8s are very capable and better than BL17s, but if you have 17s like I do, I will not swap, because the difference is not worth the extra money, plus I like the look of the 17s over both 8s and 28s.
The Theatre and the 28s were a better match and to me if you have these in your setup it relegates the 8s to a surround, back or height role.
BL8s have a role as either a surround, back or height role if you are expanding your setup to get Atmos, or preferably as a stereo set of speakers exclusively for music, or you are starting from scratch and then get as many sets as you can afford because more speakers with the Theatre is definitely better.
Last piece of insight was there was no listening position setup that didn’t benefit from having the BL19 added. So to me a BL19 should always be providing the subwoofer role, unless you are lucky enough to own 50s or 90s, even with the Theatre’s incredible bass and the bass of the 28 the 19 added richness that you can hear and physically feel. I know in the Sound guide it states 28 take bass from the 19 but in the real world to me that slightly larger subwoofer size is needed to most people’s setup.
In addition to a Theatre I have BL17 in each corner of my room with a BL19. When I calibrate for all seating positions I select all WiSA / Wired speakers and all on the BST. This means I can remove which I don’t want. I do use the different modes ie TV, Movie, Music and found for music alone having all 4 x 17s set as either FL or FR with the FL + FR on the BST only (FC, SL, SR, Height speakers off) and the BL19 on at 120Hz gives the best results for my ears.
I raised a support request as the difference in volume between some programmes is as much as. +/- 10 volume increments to maintain the same sound volume. The following was sent back:
”We have received feedback for our supervisors and would like to share the following with you, in the last software release there is a “small Dolby bug” that has been fixed and as such will result in a larger volume difference between PCM and Dolby signals.
We are working on a setting in the app, so it is possible to adjust the gain for each source, but we can’t control the volume difference in the different TV stations audio volume broadcast. This has always been an issue, here in Denmark as well.”@Paul9367, as a previous owner of a Gen 1 Eclipse 55” and a Gen 2 Eclipse, and now have a Stage with a C9 and a Theatre with a G3 65”, I feel suitably qualified to steer you to the Stage with a STB bracket if you are not needing to add further speakers or automated stand movement. The simplicity of the Stage / LG combo continues to impress me, it just works flawlessly and the sound is epic, with adequate sound processing for an Atmos effect. Remember the Eclipse’s sound is only OK and no Atmos processing.
However, if adding more speakers is your goal then I am an advocate of the Theatre especially if matched with a G3 or C3, and the party piece over the Eclipse 55 is that if you had the width for the Eclipse 55” you can probably go up to the 65” with minimal effort as the dimensions are close… that’s what I did and the extract picture size matches the power of the Theatre’s sound.
IMO do not pay for the screen repair, I did with my first Eclipse Gen 1 and was the forever looking for picture fault as I lost trust in the screen. Also the automated bracket was simply not strong enough for the weight of the newer LG TVs, and over time they sagged when away from the wall (fully open at 60 degrees); in fact the website removed the ability to by the automated wall bracket.
Their cash flow business model is genius! When you consider how many units of each new model each store is contracted to buy to ensure branding / displays are consistent even before a customer may purchase a unit, the company are shifting a great deal of inventory even their worse &/or overpriced & technically floored products to ensure Head Office is profitable.
My sympathy is for the stores (franchisees) who are holding lots of inventory including the gaudy colour material combos no one seriously will opt for, meaning these units will eventually be discounted at the franchisees’ expense. The stores also need to push quickly before the inevitable price rise, and existing customers know this so it drives demand.
Don’t get me wrong I am a fan and my dealer has repeatedly upsold me to the next model but there comes a time when. Bang Olufsen should learn from other industries ahead of legislation that loyalty trumps new sales, think about in the U.K. laws in the car insurance market where existing policy holders now get as good a renewal price as a new policy customer by law.
It seems to me B&O operate like new homes, they only go up in price despite being older and in worse condition.
Let’s also be honest… we like something shiny and B&O products are a drug for us and we find excuses to buy, even though we know the total price paid is not worth the quality.
In my opinion the company will always succeed even if consumed by a new parent company and run as a halo brand. Whether there are as many stores is doubtful, meaning servicing will take longer and costs increase to do the initial setup and installs.
Just for you trackbeo… Updated with Driver detail.
Also added Total Power, and Total number of Drivers to create a new column of Average Power per Driver.
£ for £ the A9 is the bargain of the current range!
Also Edge for raw power is so underrated for what it is now being sold for.
As someone who has a 65 G3 Theatre with 6 x BL17s and a BL19, whilst imo the BL8 are a natural successor to my BL17 they are too much money for me to swap out my 3 sets of BL17s for what I will get in return. As arguably the swap will be governed by the law of decreasing returns in what new sound detail, clarity, emotion I hear and feel.
Were I starting again Yes, highly likely I would not get a BL19 and buy a set of BL28 and 2 other sets of BL8s with the Theatre. But the price gap is too wide. Especially with the recent increase to the Theatre. I am just glad I was an early adopter almost 1 year ago. I will say my best decision was changing the G2 to a G3, it did cost me £2,300 to part exchange back with my dealer but imo worth it when the G3 was released.
My concern and rhetorical question is B&O leadership forgetting their own marketing… the cleverness of the Theatre to bring alive older BeoLabs was a big selling point, as well as sharing the bass across all speakers.
I suspect many existing customers were hoping for Atmos speakers for the height channels with the same specs as the Theatre as the up and side firing in the sound bar are good just not BeoLab good; and these BL8 are on the tech specs too good and too pricy for the occasional sound of church bells in James Bond. [side note the clip played in the dealers & on the YouTube video above is not an Atmos track, the bullets do not come from the correct location because it is a 5.1 DD track… check the dealerships app next time you demo any of their clips, it will not say Atmos… it sounds much more expansive when the same clip is played off Apple TV or UHD Blu-ray with the same setup).
Last thought… I am not an UHNW target market customer, but I do sit in the Top 3% on salary in the UK, and I have spent close to £50k in 8 years with my dealer being an early adopter or put it another way spending £500 a month every month for the previous 84 months! Explain that to your family, £500 a month is on par with average car payments or interest only mortgage payments before inflation. It grieves me as a customer who has upgraded from an Avant to Eclipse Gen1 to Eclipse Gen2 to Theatre. But with the BL8s sorry B&O leadership whilst your designers are on fire with outstanding speakers you have imo missed the mark on the feedback provided from customers like me who cannot justify to keep on upgrading when something new is released when what I have is damn fine! Plus my wife would say since moving to B&O TVs we have had 4 sets in 8 years two broke (red screen) and the Pioneer Kuro plasma we had before lasted 10 years.
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