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Its difficult to understand. I have for a long-time selected Beta-user on the App for the Products I have….but nothing note-worthy happened.

I suspect I initially had “the wrong products” with the focus on I believe on early Mozart products. Then one day, I recieved a B&O satisfaction survey and an invite to join the Beta-programme proper. The feedback method is a rather tedious and difficult to understand product page but B&O do send automated emails indicating imminent downloads and to test the system. You can report bugs, hang-ups and suggest improvements etc.

I am currently on 3 Beta programs: Mozart, ASE and Halo. The updates are coming thick and fast and my products are typically getting software minor updates 1 to 2 times a week.

I think the Beta Development team are working full-on trying to fix bugs across the product board. My experience is that these updates don’t seem to be obvious to my system and testing has not really exposed any problems (A lot of this is what you have equipment-wise, how you use it and to a large degree use multiroom)

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I dont think it makes any difference whether a loudspeaker can do Atmos for Video or Audio only – its the same. I think that all B&O speakers over the last 20-30 years can be integrated into a BS Theatre – which is Atmos enabled.

The problem is with the Mozart group of products which include the Balance which for some reason cannot yet link as either a front or surround loudspeaker to an Atmo soundbar? The BL28s can do it (with the same engine) but Balance and Level cannot??

I think B&O are protecting product financials by closing off these “less expensive” products from being used with a Theatre or Stage.

There has been plenty of noise yelled at B&O over the execution of the Theatre. I am one.

You buy a SoTA Atmos-enabled soundbar with the ability to link external loudspeakers……but B&O dont make any suitable surround speakers. I purchased 3 pairs of white BL3’s. They are the smallest most compact loudspeaker available. Its a 20year-old design. I cant hang 2 pairs of BL18s from the ceiling? BL17s are probably next in size.

In my mind, it would take someone in B&O literally a minute to make the Balance switchable from Mozart-Master to Beolab-slave (and let the Theatre do the DSP). They so far have chosen not to?? But then, even the Balance is rather chunky as a surround.

I suspect (from my sources) that B&O are working on a range of compact (and less compact) dual-purpose Beosounds – either as a single all-in-one source speaker or as a Beolab slave.

I do not expect that any one of these “possible future” Beosounds will be standalone Atmos enabled. I think you will still have to buy a soundbar of some specific type for that to happen.

[NQVHNWI]

FYI….

I’m currently on 2.5.5(1034) on the Mozart (Theatre) Beta programme.

I did not personally experience any issues on 2.5.3 when testing.

[NQVHNWI]

Millemissen wrote:

Furthermore, when you talk about ‘the best audio formats’, you will first have to define what you understand when you write ‘best……’.

Also, it would be nice to know what you mean by ‘The core is not really great and has huge limitations’.

Let me try and put across my key perspective on streaming and streaming players.

1. Listen to a few high end streamers like the Bluesoubds, the Auralics Altairs (£700-1800) and in sound B&O price territory, you will hear clear clear differentiation between those units, BS5, Core, essence on the BL90s, probably on the 50s as well. Go into the Uber high end (£5000++)  and it improves again but distinguishing the value proposition becomes more challenging.

FLAC via DNLA into Beovisions is even more muddied – but that may be a function of Powerlink. The world has moved on in many aspects.

2. In terms of sound quality (again through the perception obtained from the BL90 as a transparent benchmark) is that CD sounds very good. Where I believe and understand it is/can be improved dramatically is not having a higher bit rate/sample rate recording but having a device that can upsample a CD to say a resolution like DSD512. Now you may all cry bits are bits and you can’t make more? But – again as I understand it, upsampling “stretches” the signal spectrum and permits more effective filters at ultra high frequencies to take opportunity to subtract noise artefacts from the music signal. The DAC then operates at its computational sweet spot (my Auralic Vega G2 is best at DSD512) to “compress” and convert to analogue.

So to me and my layman’s understanding combined with my listening preference, file quality is not Uber critical, but upsampling and optimal DAC processing doth maketh a good sound and desirable output.

[NQVHNWI]

My personal opinion is that B&O make some very poor Audio players per se. There is nothing like a proper separate streamer in their line-up. Its either the Wifi Boxes, soundbar or via the TV panel App. The BL28 may be the exception?

So that aside, MQA. To me this is nothing but a subtle form of DRM and there’s plenty out there to suggest the wrapper (MQA) actually adds noise.

My Streamer of choice – the Auralic Aries/VegaG2 has no MQA. Auralic refuse to implement it and have algorithms to bypass-it or partially unwrap the music file without MQA.

Linn refuse to implement it for the same reasons. I also believe Naim refuse to implement it as well.

Last I heard a few weeks ago was that MQA had gone into receivership? There is a question as to what Tidal will do now – double down and try and keep MQA (if a Buyer is found) or ditch it.

As an opinionated opinion, however, I do think Qobuz is a superior to Tidal.

[NQVHNWI]

Millemissen wrote:

I must admit that I totally fail to see the point of playing music from a vinyl disc nowadays – now that we can get superior sound from a digital file or a cd.

I don’t disagree with you. I have a very nice BG8002, in what seems very good condition and plays surprisingly well via a cheap RIAA and A2D converter. However, its clear, digital will beat vinyl every which way to Sunday but…….1. There are people who want Vinyl (more Vinyl is currently pressed than there are digital CDs printed – so a market and 2. It makes great furniture or decoration to the living space.

On the 72-23, yes profitable. But the people who buy that have right-on interior decorators with too much money to redecorate someone’s 4th Tuscan Villa. What this does is play back to the old mantra of too much style and no substance – which then kills sales lower down the food-chain.

An absolute world class deck, cartridge and pre-amp (technically) can be had for £10,000 (and for considerably more and for considerably less) so this in my mind says B&O are starting to go back to form, wrapping a dog-turd in 24 carat gold wrapper. As before, silly people will always buy this type of gear but Im more concerned that it will stop people coming to the brand and buying-up as they go.

 

[NQVHNWI]

I’m starting to despair a little with B&O and in particular, their marketing team which makes decisions like this (more one-off special editions “cr@p”)

Look, don’t get me wrong, the deck and cabinet are lovely. With the BL28, it looks vulgar and just wrong.  The price is stupid and made for stupid I suspect people.

Why don’t B&O just make a new, modern but retro-style Beogram? Latest designs in power correction, server control and pick-up (hell why not put a decent A2D converter in there?). This deck – if properly (read competitively spec’d) would make as much impact as the Theatre has done to their revenues recently.

[NQVHNWI]

Ron from http://www.beorepairs.com  (email: sales@beo.repair) rebuilt, recapped and fixed the tracking on my Beogram8002 a few years back. The deck had been mis-diagnosed by another UK repairer.

I believe there are things he can and cannot repair. The BG5500 I doubt will be a problem, but Im not sure on the remote.

He’s based in North Shropshire / Market Drayton area.

[NQVHNWI]

I have previously cited 2 main bugs with the Theatre – one relating to configuration of the BR1 remote via the App – and too many renaming’s locks the BR1 up (this is a Theatre problem – not a BR1 problem) and the other about changing the PUC configuration when you have the source actively open in the Theatre. Again, another lock-up and a PIA to get out of.

As always, a full factory reset of the Theatre is most often the quickest way to get everything working. Since locking down my entire Theatre configuration (5.0.4 speaker config, Kaleidescape PUC, Oppo PUC, TV Lists and stations etc…) my Theatre has been rock-solid.

I think the problem is one of the core operating system of the Theatre is not very stable. Add something, then change something…hang-ups. Add everything from factory in one go exactly how you want it….and no problems seem to be presented?

[NQVHNWI]

Alarm/timer function works correctly as far as I can see.

Stations for B&O Radio

Favourites for Video Sources

[NQVHNWI]

I don’t see any except for Favourites. Question is…..are Favourites the main favs or are these for specific radio stations.

I will have a play tomorrow and report back

[NQVHNWI]

XLR is very low impedance compared to RCA.

I think you are sweating it too much. The best way to connect your receiver via RCA is as per the method I listed above.  – downgrading the BL50 max volume until you are happy with the control. Then listen.

one extra complication….does your Reciever have RCA outputs? If it is XLR only, you may need to have passive XLR to RCA passive converter? Your Dealer should be able to help?

[NQVHNWI]

My comments are based on the BL90. Im making an assumption the BL50 is the same….but you need to check for yourself. Its alos a long time since I played with these settings – so I hope I have the logic correct?

 

The Line-In (RCA) function in the BeoApp (same for XLR – which is what I use) you can define Listening Position, Detect Threshold, Time-out, Input Impedance and Max.Input Voltage.

The Max Input voltage on Bl90/RCA can be switched between 1.0, 2.0, 4.0 and 6.5Vrms. With BL90/XLR, this is 2, 4 and 6.5Vrms respectively.

As I try and recollect, I believe the way I did this with the Auralic Vega G2 DAC, is (for safety), drop your BL50 max volume down to say 50 until you are comfortable on the control and integration of your Receivers output. When you are comfortable with the control, you can increase back to max/90.

I put my Vega G2 on fixed volume, 100% volume. I use the BL90 for volume control.

What Vrms voltage you will need will depend on the sound you hear and the output voltage of your Receiver and the Vrms matching. I think the Vega G2s XLR output is maxed at 4.8Vrms. So the way I see it, this is going to be throttled back (83%) at the BL90 side with 4Vrms selected?

By selecting 6.5Vrms, the BL90 can take the full Vrms from the Vega and scale accordingly.  It also sounds the best even though though there is not a lot of difference quality-wise at low volumes (but the volume slider will obviously be higher – something along the lines of 45 on 6.5Vrms will be 54 on 4.0Vrms as a rough example)

 

[NQVHNWI]

Until my Theatre purchase (with the LG G2 65 panel) ,I had a Mk1 Eclipse 65. The Eclipse was to me a nice looking TV but as you point-out, a Dog with respect to panel burn-in and replacement.

I do not like the design of the Harmony. Full Stop.

I think the Theatre is technologically quite a bit a head of the Harmony and I think it offers better value too. Im not sure about Screen replacement on the Harmony (I mean future upgrades and different makes which have the app rather than like for like).

I voted with my wallet. Theatre all the way.

[NQVHNWI]

TBH, I would figure-out where you want your surround speakers.

I do not have rear speakers because the room will not allow it. I have ear-level surrounds a just a little past 90deg from the listening position. Likewise, I can do heights above the surround, but I cant do heights directly above the BL90 fronts.

The trick is to allow Roomsense do its job and figure out the distances, then depending on your preference, increase or decrease the volume on each channel until you get the sound/ambience you prefer. I would not over-think it and work within the real-world physical constraints.

[NQVHNWI]

When you receive your Theatre and load the BeoApp, it will guide you through the stages from BR1 pairing, Listening positions and connecting speakers.

You can add satellite speakers from the drop-down lists including BL6000s and Beovox1 and 2. You run roomsense andthe connected speakers, plus the soundbar will be room and speaker optimised. You can edit and adjust distances and levels post-roomsense.

What roomsense cannot do is know where the speakers are….or how high they are…..only how far away they are from the Soundbar. (Which I believe contains two microphones itself I have been told??).

Going thru the App and listening position configuration, you can assign position of each speaker.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[NQVHNWI]

Or…you can load the BeoApp, do a factory reset or cancel/delete the calibrations. It will be similar to this chain of commands on the BeoApp:-

Select Product >> Product setting >> Configure >> Preset >> Select a preset >> Room Compensation >>  Select model >> Delete.

Im not sure why you would want to do that as it add so much to the performance of the loudspeaker.

[NQVHNWI]

Funny enough, Ive just slammed B&O via a Customer Satisfaction Survey on the Halo I purchased a couple of months ago. I did purchase the Halo primarily to control volume via WiFi on the BL90s but its a very under-developed product that could be so much better if B&O put the effort in towards the useability rather than a nice clicky wheel volume controller. With the device right in front of me now…..

1.  Approach and this is the Theatre display automatically shown Photo (Halo1)
2. Press either the < or > and the Theatre asks for a USB stick to be inserted.
3. Volume control indication. No numerical display only a % of a tiny circle. Should match the source display.
4. There is no direct source selection. Swipe up, and you have photo (Halo4) but that is only favourites.
5. From the initial display (Halo1), Swipe down in live TV mode, no TV guide button, no keypad.
6. Swipe down again (Halo3) – Now you can select source
7. When selecting source – say Oppo DVD, you cannot control unless you thumb up back to the display in photo Halo2. Even then, limited controls compared to the BR1
8. Swipe down to the next level, you can decide to go to single or multiple B&O Standby.
9. Whenever you swipe up/down, the screen defaults to Halo1 after 5 seconds – so almost useless?
10. Power. I think for £700, the Halo should have had either a proper (BEO5/6) dock, or as a minimum, a Qi charger as standard. I purchased THE EXACT Qi charger as the B&O one for £13. B&O wanted +£100. Really?

I think the Halo has all the potential to be a killer remote. It just seems to me B&O wanted a bit of high-value tactile hardware out there but with zero consideration to the usefulness or the interaction of a standard customer? Further, given the development of Software over the years, and what has been done with Beoliving Intelligence, how difficult would it be for B&O to include an IPconfig page to configure your own Halo settings (without BLI) or just drag and drop from the iOS app?

B&O just didn’t put any real effort into this.

[NQVHNWI]

I would check with your dealer on the controllability of BL50 with BR1 directly. It may be there as BT control. I can’t tell because of the Beovision connection. All else on the triggers/threshold remains and is easy. Ditto the 3rd party App controlling your music. If you clarify the BR1 issue, you will find it straightforward enough to operate and enjoy.

[NQVHNWI]

I have the 90s. Previous to that the BL5s.

the 90 and the 50s have settings in the BeoApp which enable threshold trigger on/off and source priority. I use the BL90s with a Beovision (Beosound Theatre) via DPL and Auralic DAC/Streamer (XLR).

The triggers are set for priority XLR, the DPL (set your most used source last). The BL90s trigger on XLR signal and (IIRC, 30sec after no signal trigger off). Via DPL, it’s all controlled by the Beovision.

Obviously, you will need to control your 3rd party source with a non-BeoRemote but one problem you will have is controlling your 3rd party streamer volume. I keep my Auralic DAC at 100 volume, fixed, max 4.8v output. The use of a BR1 is a PITA if using a Beovision as you have to switch modes.

To get around this faff, I installed an Essence Remote (in IR mode) and a Beolink IR eye. That’s OK but a little sluggish. A Halo solved that problem via Wi-Fi control. I think a second BR1 in Beosound mode may also work well but I’ve never tried that.

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