Beosound Balance and Dolby Atmos

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Home Forums Product Discussion & Questions BeoSound Beosound Balance and Dolby Atmos

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  • #46701
    jpgermany
    BRONZE Member
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      Is it just me or is anyone else interested in B&O bringing Dolby Atmos to the Beosound Balance. Not for Movies, but simply for Music recorded with Dolby Atmos?

      #46702
      NQVHNWI
      BRONZE Member
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        I dont think it makes any difference whether a loudspeaker can do Atmos for Video or Audio only – its the same. I think that all B&O speakers over the last 20-30 years can be integrated into a BS Theatre – which is Atmos enabled.

        The problem is with the Mozart group of products which include the Balance which for some reason cannot yet link as either a front or surround loudspeaker to an Atmo soundbar? The BL28s can do it (with the same engine) but Balance and Level cannot??

        I think B&O are protecting product financials by closing off these “less expensive” products from being used with a Theatre or Stage.

        There has been plenty of noise yelled at B&O over the execution of the Theatre. I am one.

        You buy a SoTA Atmos-enabled soundbar with the ability to link external loudspeakers……but B&O dont make any suitable surround speakers. I purchased 3 pairs of white BL3’s. They are the smallest most compact loudspeaker available. Its a 20year-old design. I cant hang 2 pairs of BL18s from the ceiling? BL17s are probably next in size.

        In my mind, it would take someone in B&O literally a minute to make the Balance switchable from Mozart-Master to Beolab-slave (and let the Theatre do the DSP). They so far have chosen not to?? But then, even the Balance is rather chunky as a surround.

        I suspect (from my sources) that B&O are working on a range of compact (and less compact) dual-purpose Beosounds – either as a single all-in-one source speaker or as a Beolab slave.

        I do not expect that any one of these “possible future” Beosounds will be standalone Atmos enabled. I think you will still have to buy a soundbar of some specific type for that to happen.

        #46704
        NQVHNWI
        BRONZE Member
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          I’m not sure of the specifics but there is a technical problem with WISA and WiFi modules in that they have to have antenna separation over 1m apart.

          However, that should to my mind not preclude a wired option if their role is expanded to surrounds?

          #46703
          matteventu
          BRONZE Member
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            The BL28s can do it (with the same engine) but Balance and Level cannot??

            Just to be the devil’s advocate, BL28 can be interfaced with BS Theatre because BL28 (just like most other Beolab speakers) have a WiSA receiver module – something that the usual speaker from the Beosound range just doesn’t have (at hardware level). Currently, they don’t “sync” with BS Theatre over the Mozart platform itself.

            I think B&O are protecting product financials by closing off these “less expensive” products from being used with a Theatre or Stage.

            What I just wrote above however doesn’t mean that the products (Mozart or even AES Beosound speakers) can’t be integrated in a surround system with Theatre via other means (just like other competitors do it, i.e. Denon/Marantz/Heos, Yamaha MusiCast, Sonos, DTS Play-Fi, Bluesound, Bose – all without WiSA and just over the 802.11 Wi-Fi standard), and for this reason, I agree.

            #46708
            NQVHNWI
            BRONZE Member
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              I think the RJ45 is wired ethernet, the usb-c is i think another power-option without the charger puck. Both the RJ45 and usb-c are intended for permanent wall mounting.

              The manual – as im sure you have seem already makes no reference to Powerlink connections.

              Interesting that there seem to be different connection boards too?
              https://www.bing.com/images/search?view=detailV2&ccid=aMEN4n8B&id=00173BDC8A5C8ECCA7DB99CA3B9FE1C00AEB4271&thid=OIP.aMEN4n8BYlUqFbMPLhXPvgHaE8&mediaurl=https%3A%2F%2F149362691.v2.pressablecdn.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2021%2F04%2F22.jpg&cdnurl=https%3A%2F%2Fth.bing.com%2Fth%2Fid%2FR.68c10de27f0162552a15b30f2e15cfbe%3Frik%3DcULrCsDhnzvKmQ%26pid%3DImgRaw%26r%3D0&exph=1334&expw=2000&q=beosound+level&simid=608014430113958862&form=IRPRST&ck=7E9E69EBCDE16CE642B905E3DF75A8A0&selectedindex=46&vt=4&sim=11

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

               

              #46709
              Millemissen
              BRONZE Member
                • Flensborg————Danmark
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                #46705
                Sia43
                BRONZE Member
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                  Do you mean that if I connect a pair of Beosound levels to a Beolab Reseciver 1s, I could use them as surround speakers with BS-Theatre?

                  If yes, how about the room correction?

                  Would Theater recognise that it is connected to a pair of BS-Levels?

                  #46706
                  NQVHNWI
                  BRONZE Member
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                    I don’t know if a BS Level has any connections other than the power dock, and no connection to the BReciever1. All for the reason I suspect to reduce the cost of the Level and possibly to push Theatre Owners to higher-end beolabs. I.e. 2 pairs of BL28s in the opening marketing campaign.

                    #46707
                    Sia43
                    BRONZE Member
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                      Beosound Levle has input connections, see picture

                      #46715
                      NQVHNWI
                      BRONZE Member
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                        I stated this before but there are different layers of the B&O onion:-

                        1. All new B&O loudspeakers I believe will be dual purpose. i.e. a speaker and a communicator for music sources.
                        2. This means they will be more expensive than a straight Beolab of old but modestly cheaper than traditional Source + speaker setup.
                        3. There are technical problems of mixing WISA and WiFi (and bluetooth I guess) in small speakers because of the separation required by the respective aerial/antennae for each system.
                        4. I believe there are a number of new Beolabs coming to open-up the Atmos capabilities of the Theatre.
                        5. I would imagine that is going to be quite expensive (3 pairs or 6 units if each is considered like a BS Balance in different form-factor) i.e. £18-20k? where only the transducer side is required.
                        6. As you said, mozart is a bit of a mess because in my mind….like my point 1 above, it is trying to be all things to all people, it is trying to incorporate AES and other products into the control/integration umbrella, add-in complicated speakers with source/source control and it gets expensive, complicated and delayed in product release.
                        #46716
                        Sandyb
                        BRONZE Member
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                          But even before the Mozart days, Beovisions could use Beolabs speakers in a surround setup, but could not use the Beoplay/Beosound speaker systems.

                          So there has always been a separation of which part of the speaker range one could use for a surround setup.

                          This is not new.

                           

                          #46717
                          NQVHNWI
                          BRONZE Member
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                            Sandyb,

                            I think the flip on that (and Im not 100% certain of consistency), is machines like the original Beosound 1, The Beosound Century etc…were cut-down products for those who could not afford the B&O separates range of Source(s) plus beolabs.

                            Over the years, all the Sources have disappeared (except TVs), lower-end Beolabs have disappeared and there is a deluge of BeoPlay (Bluetooth?) and one-box Beosounds without interconnectivity.

                            We now have a Flagship product which has been purposely designed to accept Beolabs but there is nothing in the current range suitable for surrounds (certainly heights) and anything new, will almost certainly be a BS Balance-type product with that internal jumper crossed-over to “integrate mode”.

                            Im certainly simplifying matters by stating “how difficult could it be to integrate a RJ45 powerlink and kill all the electronics apart from the ICE/Soundboard” and use as a dumb Beolab?

                             

                             

                            #46710
                            Sia43
                            BRONZE Member
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                              #46711
                              Millemissen
                              BRONZE Member
                                • Flensborg————Danmark
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                                The physical connection is not the problem.

                                Every new (B&O) speaker/sound system has some kind of sound processing going on.
                                With the ‘common’ Beolabs the Theatre knows about the characteristics of each speaker – not so with systems like Level etc.

                                My guess is, that we will have to wait for a new connection via Mozart in order to have a proper integration with speaker roles etc.
                                The interesting question thereafter however, will be if we will be able to mix and match speakers connected with Powerlink, WiSA and a new Mozart-based connection on the Theatre.

                                MM

                                #46712
                                Sia43
                                BRONZE Member
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                                  Millemissen, I believe you are right, yet what surprises me is that B&O troubles itself by developing a system for Beosound Theatre that can accept an extended range of older Beolab speakers (And some ultra-expensive new ones). Yet, they neglect to ensure compatibility with their three most recent speakers (Balance, Level, and Emerge).

                                  If that relates to an inherent shortcoming in Mozart, then B &O must have invested in the wrong technology, as versatility is why B & O became popular in the first place, and their customers expect the functionality.

                                  It must also be true that B&O must have been losing in sales, not being able to offer reasonably priced speakers from the day Theater was introduced and will continue to do so until they either solve the compatibility problem with their current line of Mozart speakers or introduce a new range of compatible speakers. Even then, B&O will continue losing in the form of disappointed owners of Mozart-based speakers.

                                  I, for one, acquired a pair of Levels and a Pair of Emerges and will not buy another B&O product until they fix the mess they created with their Mozart system.

                                  It may be reasonable to suggest that B & O made a terrible mistake, which hurts as we all love or used to love B & O products.

                                  #46713
                                  Millemissen
                                  BRONZE Member
                                    • Flensborg————Danmark
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                                    Sia43 wrote

                                    I, for one, acquired a pair of Levels and a Pair of Emerges and will not buy another B&O product until they fix the mess they created with their Mozart system.

                                    ———

                                    • I see no mess there!

                                    They never promised anything regarding use of Mozart based speakers with the Theatre as you both your.
                                    Be happy, if – and when – they come up with such a solution.
                                    B&O is a small company, where things takes time…..you probably knew that when buting.

                                    MM

                                    #46714
                                    Sia43
                                    BRONZE Member
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                                      Sure, they never promised that, yet versatility is what their brand is about, and a majority of discussion on this site is about how people try to connect and integrate their devices into a seamless system.

                                      As many would agree, the newest line of Mozart-based speakers is a significant deviation from B&O tradition, and the question is why B&O would take that avenue. This divergence hurts the brand and customers, and it would be better if they could take their time and develop functional devices rather than offer half-ready ones with inherent problems.

                                      Which person would you hire, a student with some ideas about the job or a person who knows the job? And, wouldn’t it be even more important for a small company that is offering high-end products to make sure its offerings are functional?

                                      #46718
                                      Gaea
                                      GOLD Member
                                        • Netherlands
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                                        The problem I think with Mozart speakers to be used as rear/surround speakers is that you will run into problems when you don’t have a super stable and capable (wifi) network.
                                        There’s too many people that have mediocre networks, or, these networks become mediocre when you add wifi surround speakers.
                                        So developing something stable will take a while

                                        B&O has to add powerlink to overcome this.
                                        But people want generally everything wireless. Except me 😉

                                        #46719
                                        matteventu
                                        BRONZE Member
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                                          The problem I think with Mozart speakers to be used as rear/surround speakers is that you will run into problems when you don’t have a super stable and capable (wifi) network. There’s too many people that have mediocre networks, or, these networks become mediocre when you add wifi surround speakers. So developing something stable will take a while B&O has to add powerlink to overcome this. But people want generally everything wireless. Except me ?

                                          That’s not a “real” problem, plenty of companies are already doing that. Denon, Sonos, Beosound…

                                           

                                          Yes, obviously if your Wi-Fi network is shit that will reflect on the surround set-up.

                                          #46720
                                          NQVHNWI
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                                            That’s not a “real” problem, plenty of companies are already doing that. Denon, Sonos, Beosound…   Yes, obviously if your Wi-Fi network is shit that will reflect on the surround set-up.

                                            But it should not just be up to Wifi. B&O are one of the founding members of WISA.

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