New product launch – beosound theatre?

[Sandyb]

I am curious as to whether there was any reason for the installers to have set up the whole set (theatre, 18s and 28s) as a group called TrueImage though?!? Assuming it wasnt random, and they are possibly following some guidance?

Raises the broader question about how Atmos and TrueImage play together / work with or around each other.

Pretty sure Geoff has been anticipating (fearing perhaps!) having to explain some of this, with all the best will in the world.

[geoffmartin]

This may help – at least as a start.

Cheers
– geoff

[Sandyb]

it does indeed help, thanks very much.

Very well written too, and even a dumb dumb like me understood the piece!

[Carolpa]

geoffmartin wrote:

This may help – at least as a start. Cheers – geoff

For sure interesting reading, but…

doesn’t the Theatre have 27 output paths? Or do I mis interpreter the system?

[trackbeo]

Sandyb wrote:

Moreover one point of marketing emphasis is, as you infer, on the capability of a Theatre alone with 28s as rears

Oh duh, of course, B&O’s “model home” diagram (lounge/dining single L-shaped room) with the TV in front of the sofa and the pair of surround speakers that do double-duty as dining room stereo “ventriloquists.” Now just make it a Theatre and 28s (no front L/R) and voilà! Same as before only grander (and more “grands”).

[Millemissen]

Carolpa wrote:

geoffmartin wrote:

This may help – at least as a start. Cheers – geoff

For sure interesting reading, but… doesn’t the Theatre have 27 output paths? Or do I mis interpreter the system?

 

 

8 plus 8 plus 11 is 27 ?

MM

[geoffmartin]

Not in Canada…. 8+8+11 = 25. We work in a hybrid system alternating between hexadecimal and Fahrenheit…

It’s fixed. Thanks for ripping the thin veil off my stupidity… 😉

-g

[trackbeo]

geoffmartin wrote:

This may help – at least as a start. Cheers – geoff

Grateful for the info but worried for the result: TrueImage has the potential to cause *such* a mess. Recently at a dealer, the pit-crew scene in “Ford vs. Ferrari” sent the dialog to the Harmony center at a low volume, and to wide Celestials at about the same level!!! I couldn’t judge if the distance had been tweaked to sound the center sooner but no matter what the settings, it was !@#$%. (Using 50s as rear surrounds made for great vroom noises though!) There is no beam-width or virtual-speaker justification for open-air dialog to come from the ceiling.

<rant>Alas, no test disc (or stream, 21st c.) exists. Dolby FAQ spouts some pabulum about rights-holders as if they couldn’t force cross-licensing or just take snippets under fair-use — and then has the gall to say, “If you’re calibrating a new Dolby Atmos® setup, you actually don’t need a Dolby Atmos demo disc.” Nonsense. Suggestion: It’s a non-revenue project when writ small, but writ large, if B&O really wants their system to be enough of a “wow” that it sells millions, they will create a test to show how good the system (or installer) has done. Even if it’s the Danish National Opera playing cha-chas. Otherwise Floyd Toole’s Circle of Confusion will reign and nobody will know if the Beosound Theatre is any better than a Sennheiser Ambeo or Sonos Arc(+Sub), except, big whoop, one might play louder than the others. As @Sandyb is implying above if not stating so obnoxiously as I dare, will we all be wishing for a simple On/Off switch to squelch TrueImage, and another one for Atmos? Both “Off” forces 5.1 or 7.1 which are predictable and easily calibrated. </rant>

Regarding that dialog from Celestials, at least a Beosound Theatre when used stand-alone will have all its real drivers location-constrained.

[geoffmartin]

Hi Trackbeo,

Just like the BV11/Eclipse/Harmony, the Theatre gives you the option to not use True Image if that’s what you’d prefer, and just like the Harmony, if you choose Downmix instead, then by using only a 5.x or a 7.x output, I think that you’ll get what you’re asking for.

If you choose 1:1 mode instead, then your output will be a direct reproduction of the input. So (as long as you have outputs assigned to the appropriate Speaker Roles) then the whole up- and down-mixing processing is bypassed – which may also be closer to your preference.

The goal (as always) is to make a system that has enough “handles” to be customisable for your preferences.

 

As for Floyd’s Circle of Confusion: as much as I like Floyd (I’ve known him for decades…) I disagree with his circle. In contradistinction to this concept, there is a reference: whatever the recording or mastering engineer heard in the studio. Take 100 recordings and count how many are made with the intention of making you feel like the musician is in your living room… The number will be very close to 0. (Just like there are no movies that are created to make you feel like you’re one of the cast, or sitting in a theatre watching a play.) So the circle becomes a line, where the point of “truth” is in the middle. Of course, achieving that target is impossible, since no two studios or studio monitors are  identical… But this is a different discussion, best had over a pint.

Cheers
-geoff

 

[wanc1]

Hey Geoff,

Are the drivers in the theatre made by tymphany? or are they from scan-speak?

[geoffmartin]

Tymphany.
-g

[Beo911]

Hi everybody,

as i am in the market for some new B&O, i attended the Beosound Theatre Event in Berlin in order to get an impression on sound and build quality.

A few weeks before i was sure, that i would go with a Harmony 77″ and a pair of Beolab 28’s, which i was able to hear weeks before at a dealership and which i liked quite a bit. My plan was/is to build a system with a new Beovision as the center, a pair of existing BL18 as rears and a set of new BL28 as front speakers.

 

The announcement of the Beosound Theatre made we hesitate to go with the Harmony TV, since it is a very heavy item and quite complicated to move around. And then there was the prospect of getting the Mozart platform with the new Theatre, which would probably make it more future proof. And of course i was speculating on better audio performance compared to the Harmony. So i postponed my decision on the TV.

When the press event for the Theatre was announced in Berlin, i registered and went to see and hear the new Theatre. The event itself was arranged in a very nice place and the B&O people were extraordinary kind and caring in order to answer any questions.

The setup of the demo was a Theatre with an LG panel in front and a set of BL28 as rears … much to my surprise, no other front speakers were set up, so that i wasn’t able to experience my planned configuration.

The demo for us was a movie sequence from James Bond “no time to die”

And after that, we were able to play some music solely via the Theatre. To my understanding narrow mode was active all the time.

Conclusions:

Coming from a system of Beovision 7-55/BL10 with BL5’s as fronts and BL8000 as rears i really missed a decent width of the sound stage when watching the movie clip. The Theatre produced enormous energy and excellent control when played loudly. The seperation of speech from the special effect sounds was not so good in the demo, for my liking. But i don’t know how to judge that correctly, since i didn’t know the movie or that sequence. Maybe there would have been better sounding clips. The effect of the BL28 was quite subtle, as i sensed it,  but added some transparency/resolution and some bass. But nothing monstrous. For me, the setup with Theatre only in front was not good enough sonically, as the sound stage was to narrow/condensed for my liking and speech was not accentuated enough. So for me there have to be front speakers in the system. As i also planned to use my BL5’s in another room and setup in the future, it made me think about the appropriate front speakers for the new system. Perhaps not so easy with the Theatre being that powerful. On the other hand that could be the chance to scratch the itching for a pair of BL90 … or maybe a BL50 would be good enough … and the use the BL28 as rears. Maybe somebody here has an opinion on that.

To my further surprise, i liked listening to music with the Theatre better, than watching movies. We were able to play a few titles that i know very well and it performed very nicely for my taste. And i did not expect that from a “soundbar”, but thought it was more suited for the TV/homecinema experience, which is not the priority for me. For me it is music streamed from Qobuz and live concerts from wherever i can get them in decent quality … even from youtube … npr desk top concerts.

As i buy new systems approx every 10 years, money of course always matters, but is not the decisive factor alone … peace of mind with the purchase it is. With the BL90 i have some concerns regarding the weight and not being able to move them easily … not overly important, but still a factor for me. But realizing the strong improvements in resolution and accuracy with the newer Beolabs 50/90 i would like to benefit from that, especially since the hearing won’t get better over time as far as higher frequencies are concerned.

For now i ordered a Besound Theatre with a motorized flootstand an the adapter for a LG oled G2 panel in 77″ … and a pair of BL28’s. It it said to arrive at the dealer in October.

Best regards

Tom

 

[Sandyb]

Thanks for the post, and your impressions more or less match mine, when I heard the Theatre on Sunday.

I have 50s as left and right front speakers, and am used to a very wide (some would say massive) soundstage. And coming from that starting point, and desire, listening to the Theatre on its own the soundstage, while noticeably bigger than the Eclipse (for example), was not wide enough for me.

It is wide enough though, and good enough, to me that I can see that starting with the Theatre alone, the first sensual addition is for rear speakers rather than adding front l/r.  That to me is the difference between the Theatre (as sound centre) and the Eclipse (or other prior BV’s) where the first addition would clearly be front l/r speakers.

But like you, music is much more important to me, so the 50s up front will remain, and will continue to be fed directly (via RCA) by my Linn streamer/DAC and turntable.

Good luck with your setup though – sounds mighty capable, whether you put your upcoming 28s besides the Theatre up front, or as rears. My experience of that setup – the triangle, with 28s as rears, and Theatre only top front, was extremely good.

[Beo911]

[Beo911]

Some info concerning the pricing. For the 6.490 Euro you would get the Soundbar in cloth, a table mount and a bracket for wall mounting. As i wanted to use it as a proper TV-set, I opted for the motorized stand, anthracite body, oak grill, mounting plate for the LG G2 panel, side wings for the 77″ panel and a Beoremote One. Price came out just shy under 13.000 Euros, LG OLED panel excluded!

[Beo911]

Some pictures of a Theatre in anthracite with dark oak grill.

 

 

[Sandyb]

So that should break down something like this no?

Theatre 6490

Oak Grill 1o00

77 inch wings 1000

Motorised Floor Stand 2800

VESA interface 800-1000

That I think is the broad breakdown of the elements, and gets you to around 12300, and the BR1 probably gets you to the near 13,000 euro price.

As the TV experience, i.e the setup you’ve got, its very expensive no doubt.

If one goes for the separate wall mounting option (not the motorised wall bracket), the 2800 and the 1000 interface costs are saved…..so that setup becomes more reasonable. Of course, not everyone will want / can do the latter….but just illustrates that cost can very quite a bit depending on configuration chosen.

Nice choice though, the anthracite and dark oak looks extremely nice.

[Beo911]

You’re right sandyb,

the motorized floor stand is quite expensive, but for the adapter platform i’m not sure you can skip that, unless you want to have the screen in line with the Theatre … depth-wise.

For me, i want to have the flexibility with the floorstand to choose positions and need the moving stand because i’d have different seating scenarios in the room, which is a little larger. The 77″ Harmony would have been even more expensive, so i save money with the Theatre ??

Any opinions regarding the front speaker choice BL50 vs BL90 refering to my priorities/my use?

[Sandyb]

Regarding 50s or 90s, I listened to both at my dealer.

Though the 90s were never a realistic option for me, just a touch too big for my living room.

They’re a different beast to the 50s of course, and simply incredible. But the 50s, whilst different, are also pretty special.

For me, I wanted speakers that would allow me to wallow in music properly, and much better than the 18s that I had before (which were in themselves, and with other rear speakers etc) very good for movies. But my focus is more on music now, and whilst 50s too were a lot of money, I wanted something which would be my last ever speakers. So in that context, zero regrets.

I love that with both 50s and 90s, I could very easily let them share duties with my Beovison, because of the various / multiple connection options. My BV is connected to the 50s for tv / movies via usual power link connections. But my music chain (Linn streamer/DAC and turntable) are connected directly to the 50s, bypassing the Beovison, via RCA.

Its a best of both worlds setup, and I wouldnt have any other way.

If I had a larger living space, I probably would have opted for the 90s though – not only for sonic reasons, but also their design in more distinctive. The 50s design isn’t as strong, but with the aluminium fronts and smoked oak frets, they can be dressed up to look pretty fancy too.

You’d be very happy with either to be honest.

[beojeff]

Steve at Sounds Heavenly wrote:

Hi Beoworlders, If you are considering buying the new Beosound Theatre, please can you let me know which audio products you would want to use it with? This could be an existing Beosound music system, a Beogram turntable, non-B&O speakers, or something completely different… I will then cover how to make all the connections in my next YouTube video. Kind regards, Steve.

Steve,

A good area to look at here is cable management with an upgrade from the BeoSystem 4. My Beosystem 4 is near a wall other than the wall with my tv. In thinking about how to handle the cabling, I rather like the idea of not having to run new cables. Do you see disadvantages to using your “Shielded RJ45 Coupler” connected to Cat7 cables coming out of the Beosound Theater Powerlink sockets? That would seem like a clean way to manage the cables.

Also, I have a BeoLab Transmitter 1 that I could use with the BeoSound Theater to connect to the 4 BeoLab RJ45 ports and then use WISA to send the sound from the Transmitter 1 to up to 8 of my classic Din8 Beolab speakers. When connecting a Beolab Receiver 1 to a Beolab speaker, do you find that people prefer to use the RJ45 to Powerlink Clip-On adapter that you offer or do people prefer a longer cable like the 1.8 meter adapter that you offer?

[Author]

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