BeoVox Penta Center Channel Concept

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  • #31897
    Evan
    BRONZE Member
      • San Francisco

      A semi-relevant example for you all: The dust cap isn’t the most critical part of the speaker (acoustically) but you can see here how different drivers can be when they are hand built.

      IMG_3713

      #31899
      Evan
      BRONZE Member
        • San Francisco

        I picked up my first batch of surrounds from the post office yesterday. Getting close to putting these midranges back together.

        The last time I did this, I had a hard time finding a way to hold the outer flange down on the basket so I printed some rings to give me the ability to press down consistently around the glue joint.

        IMG_3718

        #31931
        Glitch
        BRONZE Member

          Evan,

          I use something similar to clamp the surround. Depending on the particular driver, I’ll run some tests with just the clamp. Once I’m happy with the performance, the surround gets some glue. Sometimes, a segmented clamp is needed so that the surround can be glued a section at a time with a thin needle applicator syringe.

          I’m not too surprised to hear that much of this is being done by hand. I’m guessing that the difference between the higher and lesser quality parts has to do with the “end of line” testing and sorting.

          Glitch

           

          #32113
          Evan
          BRONZE Member
            • San Francisco

            Finished modeling the woofer (basket and motor) so I can begin to design them into a baffle. Most importantly I tried my best to capture the basket’s very poor brownish-green e-coat finish 😛

            Woofer SW Model 1Woofer SW Model 2

            #32115
            Evan
            BRONZE Member
              • San Francisco

              Evan, I use something similar to clamp the surround. Depending on the particular driver, I’ll run some tests with just the clamp. Once I’m happy with the performance, the surround gets some glue. Sometimes, a segmented clamp is needed so that the surround can be glued a section at a time with a thin needle applicator syringe. I’m not too surprised to hear that much of this is being done by hand. I’m guessing that the difference between the higher and lesser quality parts has to do with the “end of line” testing and sorting. Glitch

              Indeed. End-of-line testing is paramount. From what I hear, 100% of parts are gauged by this process.

              Thanks for the tips! I am considering doing something similar, my colleagues are highly recommending I just go all-in and remove the dust cap and do it properly. Beginning to lean in this direction but I have so many of these things to do!

              #32118
              Evan
              BRONZE Member
                • San Francisco

                A quick sketch after drafting in a basic twee-mid baffle to start to package everything. Interestingly I had planned in my head that the twee-mid baffle would live on top of the main baffle surface but in reality the pentas see a baffle step in the other direction (duh). May have to rise the woofers up to match. We will see.

                Also contemplating printing my own twee-mid chassis as the original is just so hard to seal. Has very thin geometries at various points and is pretty ugly if left uncovered.

                This baffle uses a golden ratio factor but the long axis of the twee-mid module seems to be dominating the baffle shape. Tons of space left over around the woofers. This would be good if I planned on keeping the ports but right now I am planning on ditching them, this is plan of record right now but subject to change once I get into some simulations and measurements.

                Baffle Sketch 1-1Baffle Sketch 1-2

                #32153
                Glitch
                BRONZE Member

                  I am considering doing something similar, my colleagues are highly recommending I just go all-in and remove the dust cap and do it properly.

                  I always consider the likelihood that I could remove the dustcap and residual glue without damaging the cone. Finding a suitable replacement dustcap is sometimes a problem. I like to install a slightly larger dustcap than what I removed to help hide any evidence that the driver was worked on. This is usually pretty straightforward with woofers, but I’m not so confident with something like a Penta midrange.

                  Another thing to consider with dustcap removal and shimming is that uneven tension of the surround/spider will undo any shim alignment as soon as the shims are removed. Obviously, drivers with tighter tolerances will be more sensitive to things like this.

                  One idea that I’ve had is to use a combination of techniques. Combine the segmented clamp/gluing concept with using an inspection scope (stereo microscope) to visually check the coil alignment. I haven’t tried this yet, but will when I have the need to service something that requires high precision.

                  Glitch

                  #32161
                  Evan
                  BRONZE Member
                    • San Francisco

                    I’m getting into this now! The twee-mid baffle is starting to take shape and I’m definitely going to be printing my own instead of carrying over the original module from the Penta. For many reasons related to design, color (will be printed in color) and geometry in general.

                    Sketch 4.2.24

                    #32188
                    Evan
                    BRONZE Member
                      • San Francisco

                      Really didn’t like the look of the thin chamfered ring elements on the two outer most midranges. I lifted these, roughly, from the original tweemid module.

                      TweeMid Sketch 4.2.24

                      Decided to redesign the whole module with a bit more of an integrated appearance in the surfacing department. Still working out some details but this new version seems easier on the eyes.

                      TweeMid comparison

                      #32190
                      Evan
                      BRONZE Member
                        • San Francisco

                        First sketch of the box. Plenty of room to spare, inside volume is 43L at the moment. According the BeoWorld the Penta has a “net volume of 32L”.

                        Not including the tweemid sticking out, the box dimensions are 534W*319L*330H. It will shrink in the next few iterations as I learn more about the original but I’d love to hear if it should morph one way or the other proportionally (for non Ikea Kallax applications for example).

                        Box Sketch 1 4.2.2024

                        #32193
                        Die_Bogener
                        BRONZE Member

                          Make it more symmetric, move 2 of the woofers to the other side.

                          The ear can locate the higher frequencies and the mids pretty good. Lower are nor quite so important, the ear does not locate a subwoover.

                          But the woofers are not subs. You will hear, that he voice of a news reporter does not come from the TV, but somewhere else. With this design, the news reporter is always sitting on the right side, not in the middle.

                          It will be very strange, when symmetry is missing and the origin of a voice is located in different locations. And it will differ when a man is speaking or a woman.

                          It is also very important, from which hight you hear the voice.  Because of that soundbars are so popular. Slim under the TV, as near as possible to the screen. It is irritating when the voice comes not from the screen, but to far under the TV.

                          #32206
                          Evan
                          BRONZE Member
                            • San Francisco

                            The woofers are placed together in order to reduce any comb filtering. I don’t currently have a bunch of off-axis listening positions in the room yet but we are still decorating and the couch is about to be swapped out for a much larger one where one might be seated very far off axis.

                            I did a quick sketch showing the current alignment. Currently the midrange array is only 173mm off axis. The listening/viewing distance is quite long (I’ll measure it later) so I don’t think this misalignment is significant at the moment.

                            I should add, my TV is quite large – 75 inch nominal size.

                            Alignment 4.3.2024

                            • This reply was modified 1 week, 3 days ago by Evan.
                            #32217
                            Evan
                            BRONZE Member
                              • San Francisco

                              Flipping the tweemid module over I can get that misalignment to 120-ish mm. Seems pretty reasonably to me.

                              Also I recently learned that the crossovers are 700Hz and 3kHz. 700Hz is pretty high (for voice) so the 2×2 woofer config is here to stay I think.

                              Alignment 2 4.3.2024

                              #32231
                              Evan
                              BRONZE Member
                                • San Francisco

                                Make it more symmetric, move 2 of the woofers to the other side.

                                If this is of interest, to anyone reading this, I will offer this design configuration separately.

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