A.Aux Link, Masterlink and Network Link – 3 B&O generations together?

[CharlieWednesday]

I originally started this conversation here but the focus has moved away from Powerlink so I’ll no longer hijack that thread, and will start a new one!  I’ve also changed some of my equipment since then.

I want to see what’s possible in using 3 generations of B&O connectivity together – A.Aux link, Masterlink and Network Link.  This is what I have:

A.Aux Link:
Beocenter 9500, and Beogram 9500

Masterlink:
Beovision 7-32, with a full set of speakers connected (Front, Rear, Centre, and Cinema Centre)

Network Link:
Beosound Moment

I also have some BL3500 and BL2000 link room speakers but have left them out of the setup for now.

I have a Beolink Converter 1611, and have been able to connect the Beocenter 8500 (Opt.0) and Beovision 7 (Opt.2) together using that.  That works fine – audio sources play through the speakers connected to the TV.

I also have a Beolink Converter NL/ML, and I have tried connecting the Beovision 7 (Opt.2) and the Beosound Moment together using that.  This works fine as long as the converter is set up as A Master, and the Moment’s speaker settings are set to use TV speakers.  If I play a source on the Moment, the speakers come out of standby and I hear that source.

I also tried the above with the converter set as Source Centre or A Slave instead of A Master, and that did not work.  I didn’t really think it would work, as there is no A Master in that setup.

What I’d really like to do is have all of it linked together using both converters, but I can’t find a way to do that.  If I have the Beocenter 9500 as an A Master, then the Beolink Converter NL/ML cannot also be an A Master, and the Moment only plays through the speakers connected to my TV if the converter is set as A Master.

The one workaround I have been able to come up with is this – I disconnected the ML/NL Converter entirely, and connected the RJ45 Powerlink output on the Moment to the Tape 2 input of the Beocenter (using 3 cables interconnected in total!).  I then changed the Moment’s Speaker settings to Line, and connected the Beocenter to the TV using the 1611 converter.  I am then able to listen to the Moment if I select Tape 2 as the source on the Beocenter.  The problem with that setup is that both the Beocenter and the Moment are trying to respond to the same IR commands from my Beo4 and Beo6 remotes – if I hit Radio the Moment plays TuneIn and the Beocenter plays Radio.  If I hit A.Mem the Moment plays Deezer and the Beocenter plays Tape.

If anyone can think of a better solution, please let me know!

Location: Liverpool
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[Madskp]

I guess it comes down to the number of available sources in a Masterlink setup, and the workarounds we tried in that other thread is not enough to overcome this fact.

One extra possible workaround that comes to mind is if the Moment can be set to something like Option 4 where it only responds to Link + commands. I do not know if that is even a thing since it is a NL product. But if that works you could use it through the Tape 2 input without double commands.

I know other members have taken the more equipment heavy route with seperate NL/ML converters for each ML source. An example of this is this post where user Tignum has a drawing of his system with several NL/ML converters https://forum.beoworld.org/forums/topic/possible-to-use-two-ml-nl-converters-instead-of-ml-cable/#post-62861

That way it is possible to rename sources across the converters and choose which sources are available where, still with the limitation of the max number of available ML sources in each ML subsystem.

I have not tried this myself, but there are several threads with examples like this on the forum

Hope this helps solving the issue

 

Location: Denmark

[CharlieWednesday]

Thanks – I have looked at other threads already and done so again today but other than having more than one NL/ML Converter (and I don’t want to go to that amount of trouble), I don’t think there’s a solution.

I’ve tried every setting in the NL/ML converter and I’ve tried every setting in the Moment, but I can’t get full integration from any set of options.  Either the Moment works through the speakers, or the Beocenter does, but never both.

Having the Moment to the Tape 2 input of my Beocenter via an adapter cable seems to be the best option for me then.  At least it works.

One thing I’ve noticed from this set up though – when I select a source, or change the volume, or press any button really, I get series of between 1 and 3 short quiet buzz noises coming from the speakers.  It seems to happen with any button press, whether by remote, or on the Beocenter panel itself.  Probably caused by the 1611 converter as I never got that before noise before I connected that, but I wonder if anyone knows the cause?

Location: Liverpool
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[Madskp]

CharlieWednesday wrote:

One thing I’ve noticed from this set up though – when I select a source, or change the volume, or press any button really, I get series of between 1 and 3 short quiet buzz noises coming from the speakers.  It seems to happen with any button press, whether by remote, or on the Beocenter panel itself.  Probably caused by the 1611 converter as I never got that before noise before I connected that, but I wonder if anyone knows the cause?

Does this also happen when the Moment is not connected?

I have noticed this behaviour in some situations where I have done some testing with unofficial setups, but that was cases where data was involved which I guess is not the case between the Moment and the Tape2 port on the BC9500?

Location: Denmark

[Carolpa]

CharlieWednesday wrote:

What I’d really like to do is have all of it linked together using both converters, but I can’t find a way to do that.  If I have the Beocenter 9500 as an A Master, then the Beolink Converter NL/ML cannot also be an A Master, and the Moment only plays through the speakers connected to my TV if the converter is set as A Master.

The one workaround I have been able to come up with is this – I disconnected the ML/NL Converter entirely, and connected the RJ45 Powerlink output on the Moment to the Tape 2 input of the Beocenter (using 3 cables interconnected in total!).  I then changed the Moment’s Speaker settings to Line, and connected the Beocenter to the TV using the 1611 converter.  I am then able to listen to the Moment if I select Tape 2 as the source on the Beocenter.  The problem with that setup is that both the Beocenter and the Moment are trying to respond to the same IR commands from my Beo4 and Beo6 remotes – if I hit Radio the Moment plays TuneIn and the Beocenter plays Radio.  If I hit A.Mem the Moment plays Deezer and the Beocenter plays Tape.

If anyone can think of a better solution, please let me know!

2 solutions to try:
1.  as described here above. Maybe an idea to put the Moment in option 0. To start the moment on ML side give the Tape2 command and use your phone/tablet to access the Moment.

2. Make a chain like this one:
BC9500 – T1611 – BLC1 (ASlave or VMaster) – Moment – BLC2 (AMaster) – BV7 – BL3500 – BL2000.
Set the Source visible in ML  and Experience mapped to NL of both accordantly.

[CharlieWednesday]

I don’t believe the Moment has and Option 0.  Indeed, as the Moment in NL rather than ML, it doesn’t really have ‘options’ at all.

In don’t plan to get another Beolink Converter so I think I’ll leave it as it is.  It works, even if I can’t control the Moment by RC.

I diod notice something about the bussing noise in the speakers though – if I play a CD, I get a single buzz noise as the track moves on to the next track.  The display in my Biolab Pentas will update to show the track number, so I’m guessing the buzz is related to the display data.

Location: Liverpool
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[Carolpa]

you´re right, stupid thinking from this side. But doesn´t the Moment have a way to stop accepting IR commands?

it is sometime ago, but my Moment was standing in a room with several other devices, and it didn´t response to IR commands, whereas the BL35 was.

[CharlieWednesday]

Somehow, and I have no idea how, the Moment has stopped responding to IR commands.  I have no idea why, I must have changed a setting without realising it, but that works for me so I’m not complaining!

As for the buzzing noise in my Penta’s when the display changes – I’m now 90% sure it’s the 1611 Converter that is causing this.  When I used my Beosound 4 instead of Beocenter 9500 (and therefore did not need toe 1611), I never got the buzzing noise.  If I select a source on my Beovision 7 and change channel or volume etc, I don’t get the buzzing noise.  I only get the buzzing noise when an audio source is selected, so it’s coming through thew BC9500 and the 1611 converter.

I have my 1611 connected by both A.Aux able and Powerlink (Mk3) cable.  I unplugged the Powerlink cable to test if that got rid of the buzzing, but it didn’t.

It’ll take some effort because my cables are all routed and hidden, but I’ll try and switch out some of the cables between the 9500, the 1611 and the Pentas, in case one of them has a fault.  It’s also possible I suppose that my 1611 has a fault.

 

Location: Liverpool
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[Madskp]

CharlieWednesday wrote:

As for the buzzing noise in my Penta’s when the display changes – I’m now 90% sure it’s the 1611 Converter that is causing this.  When I used my Beosound 4 instead of Beocenter 9500 (and therefore did not need toe 1611), I never got the buzzing noise.  If I select a source on my Beovision 7 and change channel or volume etc, I don’t get the buzzing noise.  I only get the buzzing noise when an audio source is selected, so it’s coming through thew BC9500 and the 1611 converter.

I have my 1611 connected by both A.Aux able and Powerlink (Mk3) cable.  I unplugged the Powerlink cable to test if that got rid of the buzzing, but it didn’t.

It’ll take some effort because my cables are all routed and hidden, but I’ll try and switch out some of the cables between the 9500, the 1611 and the Pentas, in case one of them has a fault.  It’s also possible I suppose that my 1611 has a fault.

Just to understand this issue correctly I asume that the Pentas are connected to the BV7?

It could be good idea to try with different cables. For Powerlink cables note that MK2 Powerlink cables can be hard to identify. I have a cable I originally thought was a MK2, but turns out it is not as it does not have the Pin 1 connection.

Btw for this setup you can also use a 1614 converter if you have one for testing (I think you mentioned it in another thread)?

 

Location: Denmark

[CharlieWednesday]

Well remembered – I did have a 1614 but don’t have it any longer – I gave it to a friend as I no longer needed it.

I’ve been experimenting for a few days, disconnecting and reconnecting cables, and finally I solved it!  The problem was with the A.Aux cable that was connecting the BC9500 to the 1611.

I had another A.Aux cable which I use along with a BL Passive to drive my BV Cona subwoofer, so I swapped those two A.Aux cables, and I no longer get the buzzing feedback whenever the display updates on my Pentas.  Luckily, whatever the problem was with the particular A.Aux cable, it does not seem to cause any issues driving the BC Cona via the BL Passive.

I have found however that the digital coax audio inputs on my old BV7 don’t seem to work – I have a HDMI matrix with a coax audio splitter and I know that works, but I don’t get any digital sound going into the BV7.  I am therefore not getting full surround sound with my full set of surround speakers!  I’ve tried every setting but I get nothing – the digital coax inputs on my old BV7 must not be working (I’ve tried all 4).

I used to have a Beosystem 3 and wish I’d kept it now – I use a projector for gaming and movies in this room, so I might as well get rid of the BV7 and find another Beosystem 3 (Mk2 or Mk3).  At least that has direct HDMI inputs (without the need for DVI cables and splitters), and a lot more sound customisation options for the speakers.

 

Location: Liverpool
My B&O Icons:

[Madskp]

Great to har you solved the issue. Very possible something to do with the data wire in the particular A.Aux cable (loose connection, bad shielding etc.). The reason you do not have the issue with the Beolink Passive is probably because that do not utilise the Datalink connection when the Passive is just used as an amp.

Regarding the digital conenctions. On newer Beovisions in the connection menu setup you have to choose if you wan’t to use digital audio for the connection you are setting up. I don’t know if it’s the same on the BV7, but reading about it in the reference book for the BV7 sort of indicates that when I read about AV4.

Of course there can also be specific software versions with issues in this regard. I am no sure if a full software revision overview is available anywhere

Location: Denmark

[CharlieWednesday]

Yes the BV7 has the same – in the connections menu you can choose to use one of the digital coax inputs for digital audio (A1 to A4).  I’ve tried all 4 and none work.

The reason I stuck with the old BV7 is that is has a dedicated Powerlink output for Cinema Centre, which I have connected to a Beolab 7.4 in the centre of the room.  That takes over as the centre speaker when the BV7 is put into cinema mode.

I rarely use the BV7’s own screen and instead use the projector when watching movies or gaming, so I think I will look out for another Beosystem 3 (Mk2 or 3).  One will come up on eBay, if I’m patient.

 

Location: Liverpool
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[Madskp]

Another option could be a Beosystem 4 although it might be more expensive and more seldom show up used.

As that is NL based it could probably solve your source issues in the ML part of the system

Location: Denmark

[gburgess]

I have a full MCL system with multiple link rooms and a BC9500 (with BG9500) as the master, with two way remote controls. The challenge integrating this with Masterlink is that there can only be one Audio Master. And I have a full Masterlink system with BS9000 Bm5/BS5 Passive BL 3500 BV7-40. What I did was have Sounds Heavenly make a crossover cable that goes from the Tape 2 on the 9500 to the A. AUX on the Bs9000. Now I can play a record on the BG9500 and hear it on the Masterlink System. I also have many Network Link products connected to Masterlink via the Beolink Convertor. In that way I can listen to CDs and FM Radio on the prior generation Network Link products (before Mozart, which does not appear to support Masterlink integration). I have a Beosound Core connected to the AUX input on the BC9500. That enables me to listen to stream sources on the MCL and the Masterlink systems.

Hope this helps.

-Gregg

Location: Denver CO
Favourite Product: Beocenter 9500
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[CharlieWednesday]

That does help, thanks, it hadn’t crossed my mind to get a custom cable.

I’m going to wait until I have replaced my old BV7 with a Beosystem 3, then I’ll start experimenting further!

What I (and probably many of us) love about B&O is the way it works together, for example when I press Play on my Beogram 9500, the speakers connected to my BV7 switch on and I hear it.  I’d like the same for the BS Moment but I honestly don’t think that will be possible when I also have a Beocenter 9500 as an A. Master.

It’s not working too badly though – given that the BS Moment can be easily controlled from its own screen, all I have to do is select TP.2 as the source, then I can play from the BS Moment using its own screen, which I keep within arm’s reach.

Location: Liverpool
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