Beogram 4002 Series 5511 Restoration/Repairs

52 replies

Hello Gentlemen

I am a longstanding Beogram owner going back 30+ years. My Beogram 1000 was the first 'decent' turntable I owned and I still remember how I swallowed and gulped at the purchase price when I needed to purchase a new SP14 cartridge for it around year 1976. During the following years, I purchased two 1900 turntables, as well as two series 4000 which were in total disrepair and beyond resque or so the seller said.

A few years later, I bought a 4002 series 5511 which is in superb condition cosmetically and I briefly used it a few times but I always had issues with the platter speed and various other functions.

A few weeks ago and after years of having it in this non-functioning condition, I decided to troubleshoot the problems although I know virtually nothing about electronics.

The first fault was easy to spot. The arm leadscrew pulley was cracked in half. I repaired the problem by using a pulley from one of my 4000's, centre-drilled it in my lathe to make it fit on the thinner leadscrew shaft of the 4002.

Next up, I attended to the non-functioning 3V dc motor and traced its problem to an open coil on the rotor. I carefully fished-out the joint on the rotor's underside, cleaned it and re-flowed fresh solder on the joint which restored the faulty coil. I also re-soldered one of the varistors around the coils as the joint had also desoldered.

The motor brushes were almost completely gone as these had arc'ed, making them unserviceable. I then managed to make new brushes for it, cleaned the commutator segments and reassembled the motor with a fresh drop of Elna sewing machine oil at each shaft end.

I tested it out of the deck with a powersupply set at 3.4V and the motor spun perfectly and silently.

My last repair took almost an entire day's worth of testing and cleaning the control panel switch contacts and testing them repeatedly with my multimeter set to "continuity" to ensure all controls were now reliable.

By this time, almost a week over the Easter holidays had elapsed after continuous work on the 4002. I was dead-tired and should have stopped there but I thought "Victory is within reach".

And this was where it all went wrong. I once more tested all controls and functions with the mains plugged in. All controls worked, the motor spun the platter instantly to speed, the carriage worked and so on.

I went to fetch a record, a strobe disc and its cartridge. One minute later when I returned, I found a smoking motor and the top left corner of its pcb where the 4 diodes are located, also severely burned.

For some incredibly stupid reason, I didn't look properly where I plugged the motor into the board. It went into socket P2 instead of P1 and the motor got far too many volts.

So, back to square one. It took many, many hours to clean the burned wires and remove the fried varistors from the motor. And the newly replaced brushes.

I found replacement coil wire - almost identical - and re-insulated the rotor, preparing for a motor rewind. Fortunately, I had measured the coils' dc resistance before and counted the number of windings when I removed the old wire.

So, I rewound the motor. The original measured resistance for each coil with the wires removed from the commutator tags was 23 ohms and the new windings measure 25 ohms. In the pic, you can see what I did to replace the now fried varistors. I used 1 diode and 1 zener between each commutator segment.

The motors spins instantly and quietly but I haven't yet tested if the speed is right.

My apologies to all about this very long post.

Also found was a real mess on board 8, under the control pad. It looks as if the previous owner had a mono switch installed, bridging the + of the left and right channels.

Another mistake on my part. Before cutting away the non-standard tone arm wires at the 6-pin connector, I should have taken photographs of the correct sequence and colours of the wires going into this connector.

The circuit to this connector underneath the board is untouched. I have removed the non-standard armwire and I want to rewire the male plug going into the 6-pin socket but my measurements from the other multipin connector to the left, doesn't make any sense.

Tracing the wires from there, it looks like the earth return wires of the L&R armwires had been commoned. All I now is that the wire from pin 6 must be earth, going to the earth tag at right back of the 4002.

Even though all connections or circuit traces between the two multipin connectors are original, I measure continuity between some of these pins on both connectors , which I don't understand at all.

So, now I have only a single "certainty" for re-wiring the 6-pin male connector: Pin 6 (extreme right) is earth  which goes to the earth tag at the rear of the turntable, leaving 4 more wires to account for in their correct positions - Left channel earth return (blue), Left Channel (white) +, Right channel earth return (green) and Right Channel + (red).

If the earth return wires of the two channels are commoned as it appears at the connector to the left of my pic, I have even more troubkles to understand this wiring as all this leaves two extra connector pins free and unaccounted for?

i have in the meantime cleaned and repaired the board at top left, as well as replacing all four burned diodes with new items. All functions work again, including the motor.

I measured the voltage at socket P1 on the board and its output measured 3.4V initially. Later on, I measured just below 8V there, which indicates a fault. Nothing is smoking but the large soldered surface near socket P1 feels too warm for my liking so something here is also not right.

Please, can any member here come to my assistance to get this turntable working properly again - especially with the correct wiring of that 6-pin connector on board 8.

Any replies or assistance with these problems will be much appreciated. I have jpegs of the problem areas but don't know how to upload them.

Regards

dauphine

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thats a superb job you have done there, and help wil certainly arrive from the experts. Here is how to upload Images.

First go to your account, upper right corner, click signed in as, scroll down click "my files", down left you have browse and add file, on the right add folder, if you want to create diff. folders, enter folder name and click "add folder", open folder, now click "browse", in your computer find the pic you want to upload, click "open". Now click "add file", your pick will upload and show in the folder, next pic same.

to post a pic, open your new thread or reply to one, text your answer or opening remarks, click the film strip in the menu, click "browse",

Your files will show, click the folder with the pick, double click the pick, the pick will show where your curser was placed before you clicked the film strip.

Before uploading, edit your pics down to some 640 x 480 pixels, that will give you a faster upload and the pic will fit to a forum page.

Below a bad pic from my uploaded files

Location: Mexico city

Retired
Printing machine technician
Restored various 1960-70 items
Rock and Roll music
Collecting Vinyl
Restored Jukebox Wurlitzer 1050

Hi Soren

Thanks for the instruction on how to post pics. I have uploaded 4 images, one of which shows where I currently have a problem with wiring. Two others show the rewound motor coils and new brushes (profiled afterwards to fit the radius of the commutator tags) and the last pic shows the 4002 before work started.

Tomorrow, I will upload two more images of the pcb where it heats up far too much when 220V ac is plugged in to the turntable. Also, the P1 socket on the board for the 3V dc motor now puts out almost 8V dc after measuring an initial 3.4V dc immediately after I replaced 4 damaged diodes at the top left of the board.

I have found a way to remove the pins from the male 6-pin plug without damage and solder in the new arm lead to the amp if someone can please provide guidance as to which wire goes where.

Apologies for being unable to add the slash across the "o' if your name.

 

Regards

dauphine

Nice work on the coils. Do you have the service maunal or at the very least the electrical diagram for your Beogram. That would ber helpful.

The only other recomendation I would make would be to replace the remainder of the original electrolytic capacitors still in the deck.

dauphine wrote:
Apologies for being unable to add the slash across the "o' if your name.

The only one, on the forum, using the correct Ø in my name is Mika from Finland, and he only use it to make fun of me 😁.

Beautiful pics. After the mains there is usually a power bridge, I would start there checking the V after the bridge and trimmers thereafter, but as Eugene says, you will need the drawings and the service manual, where you will find the correct values and how to's, to addjust everything, new electrolytic caps is also needed in a deck of this age.

Also try the search function on the forum, a lot of 4002s has been repaired before.

To get the manuals on site you will have to sign up for a Silver or Gold membership, if you have more Beo equipment, thats a good deal.

I have repaired and rebuild BG 2404, BG 5000 and BG 6500, but never a BG 4002, now cool down for a day or 2, there will be more answers from members that knows a lot more than me within the next days.

Regards from sunny Mexico

Location: Mexico city

Retired
Printing machine technician
Restored various 1960-70 items
Rock and Roll music
Collecting Vinyl
Restored Jukebox Wurlitzer 1050

Searching I found

Location: Mexico city

Retired
Printing machine technician
Restored various 1960-70 items
Rock and Roll music
Collecting Vinyl
Restored Jukebox Wurlitzer 1050

Søren Mexico wrote:
The only one, on the forum, using the correct Ø in my name is Mika from Finland, and he only use it to make fun of me .

Apart from the Danes of course, who have it directly on their keyboard - I use copy & paste 😁

@dauphine, that's some determination with that motor!

To get you a little bit further, the wiring of the P9 connector on board #8 is as follows:

  1. L out
  2. n/c
  3. R out
  4. n/c
  5. signal ground
  6. shield ground (sleeve of the cable / DIN connector)

Dunno which the way numbering goes in your pic, but you should be easily able to work out which is pin 6.

EDIT: Duh, pins 1 & 6 are clearly marked on the PCB!

Hello All (Soren Mexico, Eugene, Ben A and tournedos)

I am overwhelmed by your replies, advice and goodwill. Thank you ad infinitum😁 and good health and Peace to you all.

There may well be further issues but I am sure I will overcome them all. As much as I would like to continue immediately with repairs, I have to stop for a day to cleanup my workbench as it bears all the signs of frenzied activity, especially with efforts to find suitable wire to rewind the motor coils - finally liberated from an old relay from one of my cars.

So, IF the motor runs to the correct speed without interference with the audio signal, I will be very pleased to share my repair details with anyone here, should there be anyone here with a dead motor problem.

As mentioned, the following problems remain: The overheating board (pics with pencil indicates where), the increased vdc output on socket P1 (up from 3.4V to almost 8V) and then the correct wiring of the P9 connector.

@ soren

Apologies for the stupid question. In my mind, I numbered 1 to 6 from left to right, which I think corresponds with your post. To confirm how I understand your explanation, pin 1 extreme left on the connector is Left channel + (White). Pin 2 is N/C - what does N/C mean? What colour code? Pin 3 is R out Left channel + (Red), Pin 4 again N/C?, Pin 5 signal ground. By this I understand commoned (twisted together) ground/shield wires? and lastly Pin 6 shield ground (sleeve of the cable/din connector). This is a problem - I have plenty of original grey din type cable here from which to reproduce the original wiring.

However, I replaced this cable years ago with a 'modern' good quality phono lead, going to a pair of phono jacks at the rear of the 4002.

This cable has Right channel + (red) and its earth return. Left channel + (white) and its earth return. Between them, runs a 5th wire which is usually connected to the earth tag of my amplifiers or pre-amps I have in use. It was this (5th earth wire) I soldered to pin 6 and to the 4002's earth tag at the rear of the turnable. Hope I got this right? Don't know what N/C means and I don't know if the earth return wires from both the left and right channels should be twisted together and soldered to pin 5, signal ground.

Once more, apologies for these stupid questions but B&O's way of doing things is certainly different to my other turntables.

Regards

dauphine

 

Apologies again. I pic of the pcb has been uploaded twice and I don't know how to delete 😮

 

 

 

 

 

 

dauphine wrote:
This cable has Right channel + (red) and its earth return. Left channel + (white) and its earth return. Between them, runs a 5th wire which is usually connected to the earth tag of my amplifiers or pre-amps I have in use. It was this (5th earth wire) I soldered to pin 6 and to the 4002's earth tag at the rear of the turnable. Hope I got this right? Don't know what N/C means and I don't know if the earth return wires from both the left and right channels should be twisted together and soldered to pin 5, signal ground.

n/c = not connected, those two pins go nowhere on a 2-channel 4002/4004. The original DIN cable has only one signal ground connection, so your RCA cable will need to share it for both channels. The shield ground (sleeve in DIN) will have to go to the shield earth on the amp. I think you have everything correctly here.

***

The IC3 your pencil is pointing at doesn't look fried to me - the metal tends to go black like that simply due to old age (some chemical reaction I think).

Test point voltages at P3 are specified like this with the motor connected and turntable running:

  • pin 3: 8.5 V
  • pin 2: 5.5 V
  • (pin 1 is the tachometer return signal)

...which would give about 3 volts between pins 2 & 3, but you should not measure it like that, measure against the ground. Pin 3 is a "rigid" voltage output, and the motor controller IC drives pin 2 to keep the required speed. It might well drop near 0 without a motor, giving you now ~8 volts between 2+3 with no motor connected.

P2 is the connector for the power LED - certainly not where you should plug the motor, but the lucky thing is that doing that is not going to damage the motor control circuitry driving P3!

So... there's a good chance that everything is fine and you could just plug the motor in, but wait at least for a second opinion before doing that!

Hi Guys

Hope you are having a good weekend.  With the kind assistance of the members here, I have re-wired that phono out 6-pin connector on board # 8. I decided to discard the fancy bit of cable I wanted to use as it was too unwieldy so I found a piece of old school phono cable with additional screen and the pic shows how I did the job.

Just about before the clock struck midnight, I refitted the main board, plugged in all the connectors, fitted the sub-platter, the belt and the platter, the cartridge and a record. And of course double-checked that all connectors were correctly orientated and the motor plugged in at P1.

Connected to the mains, the platter rotated...only through 90 degrees.

You may recall I mentioned that one large soldered area of the board got a bit warm, so a friend suggested I raise one large resistor 1mm above the board, which I did. So there's no more problem in that area. (I spoke too soon, see the following post🤔)

Continuing investigation why the motor doesn't spin, I re-checked the soldering on that resistor but all was fine.

Next, I disconnected the 3V dc motor and connected it @ 3.4V to my power supply and it spun perfectly as it did on and off the board.

This morning, I did some measuring but I admit I'm out of my depth as I don't know how to interpret the readings I got.

AT THE POWER IN SOCKET, SOLDER POINTS MARKED IN RED - A,B,C,D.

So, from A to the top check point I measured 12.96V

B) to top checkpoint, 13.40V

C) to top checkpoint 0V

D) to top checkpoint 31,6V

Same socket, 2nd checkpoint

A) 12.9V

B)13.35V

C)31.5V

D)0V

MOTOR SOCKET (Marked 1,2 and 3) Top checkpoint

1)0V

2)0V

3)0V

Second checkpoint

1)0V

2)0V

3)0V

If the same check is done (on 1,2 and 3) but this time touching on the either of the large soldered areas - 1, 2 and 3 each shows 8.65V

What do you make of this? Does this mean there's no power at P1?

 

Everything else still works. Does the work I did on board # 8 have any bearing on this? Could it be that the large capacitor 4700uf 63V has failed?

Any replies or advice much appreciated as always.

dauphine

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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