Ok, a big black box with a screen and an ugly interface. Don’t see any inspiration to get from that. 

mbee wrote:

Ok, a big black box with a screen and an ugly interface. Don’t see any inspiration to get from that.

diisign.com

Oh God, no!

The usability on this thing is terrible - they just threw in every technology they could find instead of thinking about how people should use it.

The reviewer himself says he primarily runs from Airplay (7:25).  So if you're doing Airplay, why have a display at all?  Airplay is controlled by an apple device, not the streamer.

It can act as a Roon endpoint, but if you're using it as an endpoint for Roon you don't need to be able to rip CDs to an internal drive (since your music would be coming from Roon) and you still don' need a display since Roon would be controlled by an iPad or similar.

And that interface with a long row of "app" icons?  I don't want apps on my music player, I want an integrated experience.  (If I want apps, I'll use my phone or iPad.)  The Moment's interface was much better thought-out.  There is a single interface that allows you to play from Deezer, DLNA, or internet radio - no need to switch apps depending on what you want to listen to.

I'm glad to see dedicated volume buttons - that's a must on any audio output device, as that is the most accessed feature.  But whoever designed it wasn't thinking about interaction: the power off button is right next to the volume-up button, so you can accidentally turn the device off when you're trying to make you music louder.  Oops!

He also said it gets lots of updates - roughly weekly.  No thanks, please make your product work before your release it.  Updates should only be for security or to fix something that a streaming service has broken.  (To be fair, B&O also screwed this up on the Beosound Moment- they released the device long before the software was working.  Shame on them!)

Finally, the Moment's tilted display is much more user friendly than the vertical display on this device.  With the display vertical you either need to square to control it when you walk over to the table/stand it is sitting on, or you need to mount it at eye level and then lift your arm all the way up to shoulder level to press buttons.  It's just not a user-friendly design.

For "looks flashy" this streamer gets 10/10.  But for actually using it on a daily basis, I'd take my 6 year old Moment any day of the week.

seethroughyou wrote:

A highly legible 4K display unlike the Moment which used a cheap as chips display.

...

Has software and service refinements every 2 weeks unlike B&O.

I don't like to get in interweb tit-for-tat arguments, but this post is so ridiculous that I feel compelled to respond to every single point.

>  A highly legible 4K display unlike the Moment which used a cheap as chips display.

This is false.  Although the RS-150 is capable of putting out 4k video from its HDMI output, the display on the front is a 14.9 inch HD display at 1280x390 resolution, not a 4k display.  The Moment's screen resolution is 1280x800, so more than twice as many pixels as the RS-150.  Also, the Moment's screen is has much higher pixel density because it is smaller.

And you think the Moment's display was cheap?  Well it uses the same IPS technology as the HiFi Rose's display, which is about as good as you can get in an LCD display.  And the Moment was released 6 years before the RS-150, so including that high-quality display was more of a stretch back then.

Again, the Rose RS-150 has a lower resolution display than the Moment, it's not 4k.  And the Moment's scrolling is perfectly smooth, so this is just you inventing ***.

The Moment's display is also removable in tablet form so control is possible from all over the room, not in a single location like the Rose, so I think the Moment wins easily.

> Multiple streaming services unlike Moment and Core.

Who cares?  I don't, because I can get all the music I want from Deezer and net radio.

However, if you really do want lots of audio streaming service options, the RS-150 would be a bad choice because for audio streaming it only supports Tidal at the moment.  They do claim "Future updates will provide additional Hi-Fi streaming services, such as Spotify, Qobuz, and Deezer" but as of right now the RS-150 is no better than Moment, and has fewer options than Core.  

> Intelligent playlist and genres unlike the Moment’s broken Moodwheel.

I agree that it's terrible that the inner ring of the Moodwheel no longer works.  The middle and outer rings still work fine with with Deezer, so it's still possible to get curated music streams.  And of course Deezer playlists remain available.  So I can still get playlists and music by genre or mood.

On the other hand, I don't see any intelligent playlists or Genres support in the RS-150.  Can you link to where this is claimed?

> Software that’s glitch free - very much unlike the Moment’s abysmal history.

Although we know the Moment's sad software history, I don't how you can claim that Rose devices to be glitch-free.  Have you used one?  The fact that they are updating software weekly makes me think there must be more than a few glitches.

> An app that ranks as one of the best unlike the BeoApp and integrates your DLNA and streamed content seemlessly like Roon.

That's odd.  When I look up "RoseConnect" in Apple's app store there is a base RoseConnect version that gets 1 star out of 5 possible, and RoseConnect Premium with no reviews at all.  I'm not sure how you can claim this is better than the Bang & Olufsen app which is currently rated 4.3 out of 5 with 9.2k ratings.

> Is Roon Ready like many manufacturers unlike B&O.

If I was using Roon I wouldn't need a $4,000 streaming box, would I?  I'd fill my house with Roon endpoints and a single Roon server.  I can't imagine why anyone would want a $4,000 box for a Roon endpoint.

> Many different inputs and outputs unlike the meagre connections from B&O devices.

And yet I've never found my B&O equipment to be lacking inputs or outputs.  What more should they offer?  They attach to speakers for output, and offer line or digital inputs if you want to use an external source.  Nothing more is needed!

> High quality components and toroidal power supply unlike B&O.

The components I've found in the B&O gear I've taken apart are all high quality.  I have been designing electronics - including life-saving medical equipment - for a living for almost 25 years, so I am pretty well qualified to make that assessment.  Now you're just bashing B&O without having a clue what you're talking about.  Did HiFi Rose pay you to do this?

Also, toroidal transformers for audio power supplies are useless crap promoted by the same "Audiophiles" who prefer gold-plated optical cables or oxygen-free copper cables on the AC inlet.  (Hint: those are also completely useless.)  Contemporary amplifiers use switch-mode power supplies (probably with a PFC front-end) to generate the DC rails that power the electronics and amplifier stages.

> DSD, MQA, all formats and free YouTube music embedded unlike B&O.

Yup, still don't care.  Deezer HiFi sounds the same as regular Deezer to my ears; I don't care about a Tidal-specific format.

> An internet radio service that works unlike B&O’s which broke when Tunein pulled plug on non-national radio stations.

TuneIn didn't pull the plug, those radio stations did that.  And they broke more than just B&O equipment.  This is a failure of the radio station, not B&O or TuneIn.  Direct your angst appropriately

> Has software and service refinements every 2 weeks unlike B&O.

This is the biggest red flag for me.  Releasing software every 2 weeks means they're not doing proper testing.  Even a massive company the size of Microsoft or Apple can't release high-quality software at that pace.

Also, software updates every 2 weeks means they released the device before they finished it, and are playing catch-up.

There is not much to discuss there.

If you like the device, go for it.

I certainly can’t see that as a source for inspiration for B&O.

B&O is heading in a different direction, because they have a ‘somewhat different’ target costumer........not many device-obsessed audiophiles amongst the buyers of the stuff that B&O makes. Those, who are, most likely would not be satisfied with whatever B&O would make anyway. And honestly, they have plenty of more or less obscure devices to play with - they don’t need B&O.

I can’t see myself benefit in any way from such a device - if you can, be happy with it.

MM

I’ve gone full-stupid on my gear to compliment the BL90s. Somewhere between an Audiophool and a typical B&O punter:-

•  A full Auralic G2/G2.1 Stack (x4)

•  Melco NH1 Media Server

•  Melco Switches and CD Ripper

•  PS Audio Stellar Regen to clean the digital equipment power supply

•  Some half-decent cables (but not silly cables) 

Im happy with what I have. Can I discern every component? Simply put No.

Can I discern every CD/Ripped CD/Streamed CD? Simply put Yes.

a) At best, 90-95% of all Streamer content is CD Redbook.

b) Very little is available as Hi-Res (relatively speaking)

c) Big debate on Auralic over MDA (which Auralic and Linn will not/never support)

d) They argue MQA is another iTunes conn for control and proprietary control

e) MQD is not lossless and adds noise to the signal (I can cite elsewhere)

f)  BUT OVERALL, THE MASTERING OF THE RECORDING plays the biggest part of the playback experience if done well AT ANY RESOLUTION. Too much hi-Res music is still recorded in a Cr@p and well un-dynamic way in my opinion.

My overall view as a happy consumer is:-

1. Buy what you want and can afford. 

2. A good question to ask yourself is “can I afford to buy 2 of these”? 

3. I look for clean power supply on my digital equipment. Make it as good as you can afford. Your PC (or any PC-based digital source) is the major generator of digital noise which is constantly being added to the signal.

4. I look for high sample rates – not for the music files….but to push the digital filters as high as possible out of the audible sound range.

5. Listen to the music and not the equipment. (An Audiophile is a person who uses music to listen to his/her equipment).

6. If your ripping CDS, I do not believe it is just about bit-perfect. A good quality ripper does in my opinion work better than the $5 unit in your PC. This finally leads.

7. If buying music in any format or resolution, buy the best recording (if such thing exists)

The hardware and software market is full of over-complication and one can go either/or/and. In the long run....it does not make a lot of difference I believe.  The pursuit of happiness.

Mr 10Percent wrote:

I’ve gone full-stupid on my gear to compliment the BL90s. Somewhere between an Audiophool and a typical B&O punter:-

• A full Auralic G2/G2.1 Stack (x4)

• Melco NH1 Media Server

• Melco Switches and CD Ripper

• PS Audio Stellar Regen to clean the digital equipment power supply

• Some half-decent cables (but not silly cables)

Im happy with what I have. Can I discern every component? Simply put No.

Can I discern every CD/Ripped CD/Streamed CD? Simply put Yes.

a) At best, 90-95% of all Streamer content is CD Redbook.

b) Very little is available as Hi-Res (relatively speaking)

c) Big debate on Auralic over MDA (which Auralic and Linn will not/never support)

d) They argue MQA is another iTunes conn for control and proprietary control

e) MQD is not lossless and adds noise to the signal (I can cite elsewhere)

f) BUT OVERALL, THE MASTERING OF THE RECORDING plays the biggest part of the playback experience if done well AT ANY RESOLUTION. Too much hi-Res music is still recorded in a Cr@p and well un-dynamic way in my opinion.

My overall view as a happy consumer is:-

1. Buy what you want and can afford.

2. A good question to ask yourself is “can I afford to buy 2 of these”?

3. I look for clean power supply on my digital equipment. Make it as good as you can afford. Your PC (or any PC-based digital source) is the major generator of digital noise which is constantly being added to the signal.

4. I look for high sample rates – not for the music files….but to push the digital filters as high as possible out of the audible sound range.

5. Listen to the music and not the equipment. (An Audiophile is a person who uses music to listen to his/her equipment).

6. If your ripping CDS, I do not believe it is just about bit-perfect. A good quality ripper does in my opinion work better than the $5 unit in your PC. This finally leads.

7. If buying music in any format or resolution, buy the best recording (if such thing exists)

The hardware and software market is full of over-complication and one can go either/or/and. In the long run....it does not make a lot of difference I believe. The pursuit of happiness.

Very interesting, @Mr 10Percent.

I have the BeoLab 90s and am heading down the same route. I have a couple of questions for you.

You said you have the full Auralic stack, presumably including the DAC. Do you find this gives you better sound when connected to the BL90s' analogue input compared to a direct digital connection from the streaming transport?

Do you find the music server gives better results than a generic NAS?

Do you find the Melco CD ripper (which I'm presuming is a D100) gives better-sounding files than ripping using a computer and a quality program with AccurateRip?