bayerische wrote:

Puncher wrote:

I look at my beautiful bs5000 system in the corner and, as beautiful as it is, in truth it could be replaced by a photograph!

My music listening these days is in the car, Google home while pottering in the kitchen and  BT headphones (Sony).

I remember when music was vital and important and had to be actively listened to - I'm not necessarily saying music has changed (it has but that's a discussion for when I have a pint in my hand) but me and my habits. Is it an age thing or has culture changed?

This may be for a different thred but I really believe the convenience of music availibilty has greatly lessened it's perceived value to the point it has become either musical wallpaper or else the "imbetween" stuff is skipped to only play the hits etc. 

It's truly a different world with different players and b&o are in danger of being the old duffer battling Alzheimer's!

Same here (to an extent), my BL5's haven't been providing anything but background music for years. Last time I actively listened to them (whit a drink in my hand) must have been back in 2015. Amazing what dogs and kids to to your life. 

No I don't blame them, it is me who has changed. I too agree with you Puncher, music is available everywhere I go. I have all the thousands of albums right there in my pocket. Sure listening trough a nice pair of headphones (at current my most used pair is the new H9's) isn't getting even close to the pleasure of my BL9's at a proper level. I simply don't have the time, well time yes, but not the convenience. My house is so full of B&O gear that I'm sure my wife will soon either divorce me or have me locked up in a closed mental health ward. 

I feel really sorry for you guys.

It is a pity that you don’t seem to be in control of your life.......or at least of your (listening) habits ;-)

And that you don’t seem to be wanting to change them  - and blame it an ‘age thing or change of culture’

 

Maybe facts like these are a bigger thread to B&O than anything else.....why should B&O keep on producing stuff that nobody needs?

Having a lot of B&O seems absurd, when you don’t use it.....unless you want to live in a museum without wife ;-))

 

MM

Take a breath.

There obviously has been change in how people listen to music over the last 20 years or so.

Not just on the go, but even at home, with fewer wanting / needing audio gear as a visible or feature part of their living set up.

That's a challenging environment for B&O ( and others).

One that they have not made easier, with their horrific execution and all over the pace design language.

Your default position of batting away any or most critique has proved to be horribly wrong.

Yes, ppl still hang around in hope, but that's a different issue.

The share price does not lie.

 

Millemissen wrote:

bayerische wrote:

Puncher wrote:

I look at my beautiful bs5000 system in the corner and, as beautiful as it is, in truth it could be replaced by a photograph!

My music listening these days is in the car, Google home while pottering in the kitchen and  BT headphones (Sony).

I remember when music was vital and important and had to be actively listened to - I'm not necessarily saying music has changed (it has but that's a discussion for when I have a pint in my hand) but me and my habits. Is it an age thing or has culture changed?

This may be for a different thred but I really believe the convenience of music availibilty has greatly lessened it's perceived value to the point it has become either musical wallpaper or else the "imbetween" stuff is skipped to only play the hits etc. 

It's truly a different world with different players and b&o are in danger of being the old duffer battling Alzheimer's!

Same here (to an extent), my BL5's haven't been providing anything but background music for years. Last time I actively listened to them (whit a drink in my hand) must have been back in 2015. Amazing what dogs and kids to to your life. 

No I don't blame them, it is me who has changed. I too agree with you Puncher, music is available everywhere I go. I have all the thousands of albums right there in my pocket. Sure listening trough a nice pair of headphones (at current my most used pair is the new H9's) isn't getting even close to the pleasure of my BL9's at a proper level. I simply don't have the time, well time yes, but not the convenience. My house is so full of B&O gear that I'm sure my wife will soon either divorce me or have me locked up in a closed mental health ward. 

I feel really sorry for you guys.

It is a pity that you don’t seem to be in control of your life.......or at least of your (listening) habits ;-)

And that you don’t seem to be wanting to change them  - and blame it an ‘age thing or change of culture’

 

Maybe facts like these are a bigger thread to B&O than anything else.....why should B&O keep on producing stuff that nobody needs?

Having a lot of B&O seems absurd, when you don’t use it.....unless you want to live in a museum without wife ;-))

 

MM

 

Sandyb wrote:

Take a breath.

There obviously has been change in how people listen to music over the last 20 years or so.

Not just on the go, but even at home, with fewer wanting / needing audio gear as a visible or feature part of their living set up.

That's a challenging environment for B&O ( and others).

One that they have not made easier, with their horrific execution and all over the pace design language.

Your default position of batting away any or most critique has proved to be horribly wrong.

Yes, ppl still hang around in hope, but that's a different issue.

The share price does not lie.

 

Go take a breath yourself - I was just adressing the fact that these two posts state, that you have to be active to choose to listen actively.

That is nothing that you can blame ‘the changes how people listen or the dog’.

If you don’t or won’t want to do that, it is a personal choice - nothing more, nothing less.

 

And that fact has - as you wrote - brought up challenges to what B&O can sell, produce.

B&O has IMO in reality made lots of product that might appeal more to that kind of listening - think of BS1/2, A9, the BS Shape.

The problem is, that many on the forum think these new things need to have an oldschool design to be good.....and therefore don’t buy them.

N.B. Why should I blame ‘bad sw’, when my things generally are working well - call that having a ‘default position’, if you want.

 

P.S. It is very long ago that the share prices were up - and B&O is still here.

We hear the same song from the forum members each time there has been a quarterly or yearly report from B&O.....keep it cool!

I am positive that the new CEO can bring up some changes - but I fear it won’t be changes that can satisfy the/most forum menbers.

 

MM

I'm perfectly calm, and wasn't the one moving it the person realm or expressing pity.

Some of those, myself included, do have products like the A9 or one of the BS 1/2.

But as I've said to you before when you've constantly defended any critique with "well my stuff works" - if you had none of your existing (mostly not current) gear, and had to start from scratch, you'd be less happy than you are now, and would struggle to end up with something as elegant as you have now (a work around like a 3rd party screen and BS4 for ex, may well function for you, but its hard to argue its as elegant as what you have now).

They may well survive, who knows, but thats different from flourishing. 

And while there are still people willing in theory to sink money into a B&O infrastructure at home, when it comes to bigger ticket items (not A9s), its a tough choice at the moment, when its not clear what if any company you will be facing off against customer service wise over the life of the product.

Thats entering vicious circle territory, which raises darker possibilities than one of just survival.

 

Millemissen wrote:

Sandyb wrote:

Take a breath.

There obviously has been change in how people listen to music over the last 20 years or so.

Not just on the go, but even at home, with fewer wanting / needing audio gear as a visible or feature part of their living set up.

That's a challenging environment for B&O ( and others).

One that they have not made easier, with their horrific execution and all over the pace design language.

Your default position of batting away any or most critique has proved to be horribly wrong.

Yes, ppl still hang around in hope, but that's a different issue.

The share price does not lie.

 

Go take a breath yourself - I was just adressing the fact that these two posts state, that you have to be active to choose to listen actively.

That is nothing that you can blame ‘the changes how people listen or the dog’.

If you don’t or won’t want to do that, it is a personal choice - nothing more, nothing less.

 

And that fact has - as you wrote - brought up challenges to what B&O can sell, produce.

B&O has IMO in reality made lots of product that might appeal more to that kind of listening - think of BS1/2, A9, the BS Shape.

The problem is, that many on the forum think these new things need to have an oldschool design to be good.....and therefore don’t buy them.

N.B. Why should I blame ‘bad sw’, when my things generally are working well - call that having a ‘default position’, if you want.

 

P.S. It is very long ago that the share prices were up - and B&O is still here.

We hear the same song from the forum members each time there has been a quarterly or yearly report from B&O.....keep it cool!

I am positive that the new CEO can bring up some changes - but I fear it won’t be changes that can satisfy the/most forum menbers.

 

MM

 

I hear the eclipse mk2 isn’t too far away

So everyone calm your farm 😎

I think we have all discussed B&O being in trouble many times and they seem to weather the storm.

Recently they posted a few job ads for software people so I’m sure it’s a focus for them

Even if coding is done overseas it’s not the coding but the management of the coding and testing and creating accurate test cases that’s important against that code.

If I can save enough I’m likely to get an eclipse over a harmony because of the fact of the moving stand and a few other things too.

But it is correct to assume that customer service is the priority here.

B&O I always say: You have no customers, you have no business. So keep that in mind.

And I don’t care if others say you’re a small company. I don’t care. You are playing in a global market. You’re in most countries.

Also B&O you cant contravene local country laws. If I bring a product back for a refund and it’s stipulated in my countries law. I don’t care whether you want to accept that or not.

Nor do I need to wait for you to accept a return back in Denmark.

You’re not above the law.

And yes. My farm is calm.

Sandyb wrote:

I'm perfectly calm, and wasn't the one moving it the person realm or expressing pity.

Some of those, myself included, do have products like the A9 or one of the BS 1/2.

But as I've said to you before when you've constantly defended any critique with "well my stuff works" - if you had none of your existing (mostly not current) gear, and had to start from scratch, you'd be less happy than you are now, and would struggle to end up with something as elegant as you have now (a work around like a 3rd party screen and BS4 for ex, may well function for you, but its hard to argue its as elegant as what you have now).

They may well survive, who knows, but thats different from flourishing. 

And while there are still people willing in theory to sink money into a B&O infrastructure at home, when it comes to bigger ticket items (not A9s), its a tough choice at the moment, when its not clear what if any company you will be facing off against customer service wise over the life of the product.

Thats entering vicious circle territory, which raises darker possibilities than one of just survival.

 Although my two tv’s aren’t from the current range, the backbone of my whole-house setup is NL and therefore current.

And I have enough experience ‘away from home’ to know, what I am talking about.

 

Sorry to say it - those who write here is a minority of the B&O (device) owners and honestly those with no problem don’t post on socalled social media.

There are a lot of people out there, who just use their gear.

Not that I wouldn’t want to discuss what could be made better or different (for me and in general).

I am just hesitant with these discussions here, because it mostly ends up in B&O being completely unable to do anything right, having no clue of SW and best close their doors and sell to Huawei (as somebody recently proposed).

The result is that I - with my positivity - is being scolded as being a default fanboy.

 

IMO there are a lot of things, that B&O does right!

I would not want to miss what they do nowadays....even if I dislike the winky, winky Harmony and actively look for options maintaining rhe B&O backbone in my setup at home (you referred to my post with the 3rd party screen).

 

MM

Sandyb wrote:

Your default position of batting away any or most critique has proved to be horribly wrong.

Good reply Sandyb. 

 

I experience the same lack of time to listen to my Beolab 5s since I have become a father in 2014. To be honest I listen more to my homepods spread around in the house than to my BL5 in the lounge. And to my headphone while commuting (on trains and in the car). Do I totally agree with this comment! However, since recently I do listen again to my pentas since I moved those at the sea 🙂.

You're right, there is the risk that the subset of forum members may be representative of selection bias.

The most comprehensive referendum on their prospects though is their sales figures, which have been so awful the investor presentation itself describes it as a crisis. Maybe they should bring you along to tell investors that (a) my (older) stuff still works well, and (b) they still do some things well.  Sure that will sort out the share price.

As for their software, it's been far closer to an absolute disaster and barely fit for purpose than it has to be either leading edge, on par, or what a premium brand should be delivering. 

When the head himself describes them as being in a crisis, your protestations over recent years questioning why people are complaining have been shown to lack credibility.

That all said, I hope they find a way forward, through whatever route, sufficient to be able to continue to offer some strong products.

 

 

Again, an Eclipse Mk 2 is nowhere near imminent or coming at all.

Yes they definitely thought about it, but that was a. while ago, and do not hold your breath.

 

 

Aussie Michael wrote:

I hear the eclipse mk2 isn’t too far away

 

 

So everyone calm your farm 😎

 

 

I think we have all discussed B&O being in trouble many times and they seem to weather the storm.

 

 

Recently they posted a few job ads for software people so I’m sure it’s a focus for them

 

 

Even if coding is done overseas it’s not the coding but the management of the coding and testing and creating accurate test cases that’s important against that code.

 

 

If I can save enough I’m likely to get an eclipse over a harmony because of the fact of the moving stand and a few other things too.

 

 

But it is correct to assume that customer service is the priority here.

 

 

B&O I always say: You have no customers, you have no business. So keep that in mind.

 

 

And I don’t care if others say you’re a small company. I don’t care. You are playing in a global market. You’re in most countries.

 

 

Also B&O you cant contravene local country laws. If I bring a product back for a refund and it’s stipulated in my countries law. I don’t care whether you want to accept that or not.

 

 

Nor do I need to wait for you to accept a return back in Denmark.

 

 

You’re not above the law.

 

 

And yes. My farm is calm.