Actually the BeoTime is a definite return to form! Very tactile, easy to use and a total joy. More like this please!

>>How much buyers remorse when the owners finally realize how limited and out-dated their "cool looking stuff" really is<<

For some, the limitations don't matter. I still play my CDs and watch DVDs. I am less bothered by what others may perceive as shitty picture quality then by cheap plastics and multiple remotes or cables all over the place (the later I live with as I can't justify a custom install just yet).

The custom install market is certainly something where B&O can easily compete, with a Loewe not so much I guess. There is a price for materials used and design and I don't think it's in the cards that they go head on head with Loewe. You can't turn a company on a dime without investing and I don't see that they have the funds to do that.

What annoys me the most right now is, that simplicity is gone. The BS5 for examples supports more audio formats then it needs, yet most of them incomplete - gapless playing for DJ mixes, concerts and classic music anyone? Right, just works from Windows even though they "support" macs. Too many ifs and thens or my taste. 

This thread is real interesting but the reality is that we have discussed this to death.  However I have a few more thoughts.

Things are changing fast which is partly technological and partly the financial crisis.  B&O is struggling to figure out where to invest its resources to come up with a product line that pleases it’s intended market.  They have made a few mistakes but generally are doing well enough I believe that they will be even better after the recession.  Got to be optimistic here!

One of the problems in this forum is B&O is always compared to Apple.  I guess that’s okay but remember Apple’s capitalization is 300 times larger than B&O at about $254 billion dollars.  B&O introduces maybe 2 or 3 new products every year with at lot less resources.  Yes,  Apple is very cool but it is unfair to compare B&O to Apple.  I love Apple products and have iPods and AppleTV.  However I still purchased a Beosound 5 which is very different.  I have no problem maintaining 2 music libraries....iTunes and BS5. 

Apple does not manufacture anything is it’s home country and they manage their money in tax free Nevada.  B&O manufactures mostly in their home country and in other parts of the EU.  They pay much higher taxes.  Which company is a better corporate citizen?  If this doesn’t matter then B&O can do just like Apple.....have a few brainy workers design products in their home country and manufacture everything in China.  Prices would surely drop.  I have always been a little chagrined when opening a new Apple product and the first thing I see is ‘Designed in California’.  I am never really sure what that means.  I should also point out that Apple made a speaker for the iPod which Steve Jobs declared was the best ever.  It has since been withdrawn from the market.

I would take exception to Trip’s remark that B&O does not have to improve market share to be successful.  Of course they need to increase market share.  That’s why B&O is selling automotive systems, opening stores in China and Russia, and making alarm clocks.  I am looking forward to the Beotime release .  Until recently, I would never have thought of buying a $400 alarm clock much less any alarm clock.  My iPhone has been my alarm clock.  I think Beotime is going to be a clever product that should sell very well.  If you can’t afford the Aston, you can always buy the alarm clock.

Mfirst (Michael),  I think I understand your frustration.  You are moving in the direction of Mcintosh labs which is very different than B&O.  I have looked at Mcintosh labs and was very impressed with their music server, the MS 750.  It has a larger disk and an inbuilt CD player/burner which maybe B&O should have included in the Beosound 5.  The MS 750 also plays FLAC lossless files and sounds wonderful.  However I couldn’t get over the external design of Mcinstosh labs.  To me its a circa 1960s design with a lot of blue lighted meters.  You might want to check this website for more information on the owners of McIntosh labs. http://www.dm-holdings.com/eng/

Buy B&O products second-hand ... then you get value for money and don't have to worry too much about what you don't get brand new. That's my philosophy. I won't ever be buying a new B&O TV again.

Simon.

I can see some sense in that ,but how can you buy 2-5 years old tv set £3.5-£7k when their current  set is already  outdated by miles

... interesting. I am glad I am not alone in this.

I see a lot of B&O fans that have been let down. I can safely say that most here would love to see B&O at the top.

I am really ignorant about B&O internal structure but it almost looks like the are a three man show. Not many new ideas and userfriendliness seems a thing soon to be forgotten. Sader is the fact that realativelly "little" would make most of their products, especially the TVs, be actually worth the price. A built in AppleTV in their all their TVs coupled with an internal HardDisk recorder would put all the BeoVisions back on top. I am sure that something could be worked out between Apple and B&O. They still have a name and cross-marketing would be great for Apple stating that "Now all B&O TVs come with built-in Apple TV". If Apple is not interested than talk to Amazon and do your own interface. Too bad there is a lack of "vision" here...

As for the rest of the products only a little common sense would also improve on all items. As somebody mentioned before; The BeoSound 5 is a mediocre piece of kit. Just add Wifi, 2 Tb. and a built in Movie pay/download internet service and you would have a bomb!

Thanks for all your replies.

D.

The_Beonic_Man wrote:

Buy B&O products second-hand ... then you get value for money and don't have to worry too much about what you don't get brand new. That's my philosophy. I won't ever be buying a new B&O TV again.

Very true - the BL9s and BL5s are very underpriced, second hand. BL5s for £7500? Bizarre. They always sell quickly, too, which implies the price could be higher!

I suppose a MKIII for around £5500 would be a good buy - you'd get the 7.2 and stand with that, too. You can always keep those and upgrade the panel, later, when a MKV comes on-sale :)

What I find absurd in the electronics market is the latest and greatest is always just a few months from being obsolete.  Too many people are getting hung up on the latest and greatest gadget be it plasma vs lcd, vs DVI, vs HDMI VS progressive scan vs component, vs S-video, vs composite,  vs VHS, vs laser disc, vs DVD, vs blue ray and on and on blah, blah blah,  Too many fall victim to technology claims which are only marketing to minor improvements and of no substance to life in general.  In my humble opinion people need to slow down. Many have allowed technology to rule their lives.  Face it,  nothing will be totally integrated with everything let alone most products EVER!  Apple enthusiasts people complain too!  Don't be marketing foolish in the "I must have the latest and greatest new crap.  I've been there and I am done with it and I must say  am much happier for it.

B&O is not "in-line" with the latest throw away product that  too many seem willing to accept and pay for over and over again.  I am embarrassed to admit to all the stuff I purchased over the years that was the latest and greatest technology that I paid top dollar for just two years ago which is now sitting in a box that no one wants anymore and I can't give a way None of my B&O is boxed up waiting to be tossed and it's over ten years old.  If you are in that constant  trash all I have and buy new"upgrade-itis"position don't blame B&O.  Think about what your spending on products only to throw it away on the next thing or gadget claiming to be the "must have" and think about the last time you heard the same line.  Oh and I doubt their new products will work with their old products either. 

R Patton wrote:

What I find absurd in the electronics market is the latest and greatest is always just a few months from being obsolete.  Too many people..

Yeah, but to be fair, B&O were selling TVs without HDMI up until fairly recently. I know you say 'months', but they were years behind in this example.

My concern isn't with the 'latest and greatest' features. I don't think that many people are demanding OLED before Samsung. It would be just good if they can improve *their* own technologies - such as digital masterlink and being able to distribute a digital TV signal around your home. Again, these aren't months out of date, they are years out of date....yet they are their own technologies.

See?

Agree with this - but I still have CRTs which produce very nice pictures. I am not about to buy a new B&O TV or the BS5 when they don't work with the technology they are designed to use. TVs with only one digital tuner and no recording medium or digital music players which simply don't do what they should will always be useless - even in ten years time. A poor product now will always be a poor product - a good product will always be good.