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If I were the B&O CEO

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The Beonic Man
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BeoGreg:
Am I the only one that be tempted by an Eclipse offer ?

Yes!

BV11-46, BV8-32, V1-32, BS2, P6, A1, H95, E8, BR1, Beo4, Essence

SHEFFIELD
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SHEFFIELD replied on Tue, Dec 19 2017 2:59 PM

20% off on Avant 55...

Jeff
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Jeff replied on Tue, Dec 19 2017 5:08 PM

vikinger:

I have seen this issue in another engineering field altogether different from electronics.

If the design and engineering (inc software) is right, you can justify a high price and the income will flood in.

If you overcharge for a poor product you are doomed. B&O has somehow achieved both simultaneously with the Play range and the BL90 etc.

In the long run it's the design and engineering that is remembered rather than price. The CEO needs to remove all poor quality from the range........ selling some of it cheap (in relative terms) just ruins the brand.

Graham

Many moons ago, a company who's name I forget, had a tag line that said, essentially, "the quality will be remembered long after the price is forgotten." I think this is true, no matter how expensive or cheap the product, but especially so for expensive gear. But, even for a "cheap" product (and Play ain't cheap), once you experience poor quality, it's hard to shed that "it's crap" image.

Jeff

I'm afraid I'm recovering from the BeoVirus. Sad

Sal
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Sal replied on Tue, Dec 19 2017 6:46 PM

Jeff:

it's hard to shed that "it's crap" image.

Even more difficult to shed the “overpriced crap” image. People also say “you get what you pay for” I wonder how valid that is now now for B&O. Not saying that B&O is overpriced crap, however the question remains:  is owning B&O today more of a hassle than owning another brand? If the answer is yes, then what are B&O customers paying a premium for? If you want to own something that just works, doesn’t need tweaking, is predictable, and perfoms well.. is B&O the answer?

seethroughyou
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Jeff:

Many moons ago, a company who's name I forget, had a tag line that said, essentially, "the quality will be remembered long after the price is forgotten."

Jeff

Beovirus victim, it's gotten to be too much to list!

That was Henry Royce of Rolls Royce, I think.

.

 

 

Present: BL90, Core, BL6000, CD7000, Beogram 7000, Essence Remote.

Past: BL1, BL2, BL8000, BS9000, BL5, BC2, BS5, BV5, BV4-50, Beosystem 3, BL3, DVD1, Beoremote 4, Moment.

.

KMA
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KMA replied on Tue, Dec 19 2017 7:32 PM
Sal:

If you want to own something that just works, doesn’t need tweaking, is predictable, and perfoms well.. is B&O the answer?

This seems to depend on which product you have. Across the product line, no, B&O is not the answer.

Also, as is apparent in other threads, if you have a product that works, avoid software / firmware updates.

If I were the CEO of B&O, I'd take a long & hard look at software, and figure out how to sort out the mess. This would mean, in all likelyhood, giving the axe to some products – as they are doing (eg. Moment).

I'd also be worried about new speakers that rely too much on DSP (again, software). Apparently there are issues even with speakers, eg. BeoLab 50.

Either simplify or increase resources in the core areas such as audio. Decreasing resources in the audio department – like B&O has done in the video department – is NOT the way forward.

When B&O audio fails, they are done. They have no businesses to fall back on, having sold ICEpower & Automotive. There's of course BeoPlay, but given the feedback especially at facebook, BeoPlay is throwaway electronics sold at too high a price.

Also, adjust the prices to relative to each product's value proposition, especially if customers continue to be alpha-testers and everything is outsourced to China & partnerships.

B&O need focus. Actually, I think they need to build much of the company again, from the ground up – including their brand reputation.

If I were B&O CEO, I'd be furious. I hope he is. Furious is a sign of passion.

KMA

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The Beonic Man
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Good post KMA. I am with you on everything you wrote. That's my thoughts exactly - B&O do need to start again from scratch. They've lost their way completely. They are definitely not value for money and in fact we are paying a premium for products that don't actually work properly! It's completely ridiculous. Apple are what B&O used to be. Simon.

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SHEFFIELD
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SHEFFIELD replied on Wed, Dec 20 2017 8:01 AM

Having worked  for the brand for over 30 years, I also long for the good old days, when products "just worked' and you didn't see customers for many years until a new TV was required or 'add ons' to the existing system.

Yes, B&O have some software issues, but the reality is most brands, from Porsche to Sonos have issues - if it is software driven, then you can bet at some stage there will be issues.

I have customers with very high end cars telling me off the horrendous software issues with their cars.

Anyway, I stand back to await the torrent that this will receive defending the brand, although I fully accept that B&O are far from perfect, I still love the brand, and just about to set off on my 3 hour round trip to open my store, expect there will be a massive queue of happy customers queuing to get in 😀

svinaik
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svinaik replied on Wed, Dec 20 2017 10:09 AM

SHEFFIELD:
I still love the brand, and just about to set off on my 3 hour round trip to open my store, expect there will be a massive queue of happy customers queuing to get in 😀

That I do wish you Nick. You are truly a gentleman and a great brand ambassador. Wish B&O corporate was run by people like you.

elephant
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elephant replied on Wed, Dec 20 2017 10:26 AM
svinaik:

SHEFFIELD:

I still love the brand, and just about to set off on my 3 hour round trip to open my store, expect there will be a massive queue of happy customers queuing to get in 😀

That I do wish you Nick. You are truly a gentleman and a great brand ambassador. Wish B&O corporate was run by people like you.

Agreed !

BeoNut since '75

Duels
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Duels replied on Wed, Dec 20 2017 11:33 AM
SHEFFIELD:

Anyway, I stand back to await the torrent that this will receive defending the brand, although I fully accept that B&O are far from perfect, I still love the brand, and just about to set off on my 3 hour round trip to open my store, expect there will be a massive queue of happy customers queuing to get in 😀

Well I’m a very happy customer of Nick’s although I’m not queuing at the door right at the moment.

Core and essence remote in the new year I think, to replace the BS5.
The Beonic Man
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There is no doubt Nick is a great brand ambassador for the brand and the type of person you want to do business with. I have spoken with him several times over recent years. The problem is not with the dealers or the dealerships; rather the products. I would queue at the door gladly, but truthfully, what would I be queuing for? I am hoping for a killer product, something revolutionary and worth the premium, so a modern day BS9000 for example, or a modern day BV5 equivalent. There is nothing. Several posters on different threads have suggested we (as a forum) suggest what we want to see from the brand but that is the job of the designers and what I always thought I was paying a premium for! It's not my job to design the products - instead it's my job to purchase them if I like them. I've been waiting since 2009 and I am still waiting. The LG W7 'wallpaper' TV is a great example of what I would expect from B&O; I refer to the soundbar with its movement rather than the panel size, which I would not expect B&O to create given their lack of financial resources. They could do so much more though, so as I have echoed on different threads of late, there products are incredibly lazy efforts, certainly not worthy of my money or time. Simon.  

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milkypete
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milkypete replied on Wed, Dec 20 2017 8:34 PM

There are two brands I immediately think of, that were in similar situations.  Porsche and Apple.  Both were (and still are) seen as over-priced and paying a premium for the marque.  What saved both?  Fans of the brand may not have loved them, but the Boxster, and the iMac brought new users and cash.  Is BeoPlay the answer?  I'm not sure about that.  I think a truly exciting product, at a realistic price-point is the start.  Once consumers love their €1000 item, they are intrigued by the €5000 next level item.  I think B&O needs to figure out THAT ITEM, and get new users involved.

 

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Jeff
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Jeff replied on Wed, Dec 20 2017 8:38 PM

What really saved Porsche was the Cayenne, though personally a Porsche SUV is still just anathema. The CE business is a far cry from cars though. I went and looked at, for example, Bose's page, what a conglomeration of things none of which are what they were. Their selection of home stereo speakers is limited and even crappier than usual for them, they don't even sell the 901s anymore. But they do seem to sell a lot of personal, Play type devices. And hint hint, a soundbar.

Jeff

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Tassos
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Tassos replied on Thu, Dec 21 2017 7:06 AM

Stick to the core elements:

Integration of products: Vertical (TV+Audio) and Horizontal (Old equipment and new equipment).

Superior Sound with great design.

Invest in sound technologies.

Extend the compatibility of the automation products (BLGW).

What I would change:

Keep the stores but make life easier for the dealers. For example announcing a product and make it available to dealers 4-5 months later is not the way to go. On the other hand ditching the stores will make the brand "cheaper".

Take some action as far as new products becoming available on eBay with a huge price cut is concerned. After 10 days that BeoLab 90 was announced it was available for about 60% of the dealer price on eBay.

Create a refurbished section in every store.

Change the attitude towards technology. Do not chase the technology just follow it. LG deal is towards this goal. (A BeoSystem 5 as someone else mentioned is a good way to go since it allows for easily swapping screens).

Simonbeo
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Simonbeo replied on Thu, Dec 21 2017 9:50 AM

Jeff:

What really saved Porsche was the Cayenne, though personally a Porsche SUV is still just anathema. The CE business is a far cry from cars though. I went and looked at, for example, Bose's page, what a conglomeration of things none of which are what they were. Their selection of home stereo speakers is limited and even crappier than usual for them, they don't even sell the 901s anymore. But they do seem to sell a lot of personal, Play type devices. And hint hint, a soundbar.

All Porsches use the same basic design language. In the days of David Lewis it was the same for B&O but now there is a "let's have another go" look about the range of products. It's always good if the customer or potential customer feels there's a plan.

Beo Century ,Beoplay V1, Beocenter 6, Ex-Beolit 12, Beotime , A8. Beolit 15 , Form 2i , Beolab 2000, Beoplay A3.Beosound 1

Jeff
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Jeff replied on Thu, Dec 21 2017 10:28 AM

Simonbeo:

Jeff:

What really saved Porsche was the Cayenne, though personally a Porsche SUV is still just anathema. The CE business is a far cry from cars though. I went and looked at, for example, Bose's page, what a conglomeration of things none of which are what they were. Their selection of home stereo speakers is limited and even crappier than usual for them, they don't even sell the 901s anymore. But they do seem to sell a lot of personal, Play type devices. And hint hint, a soundbar.

All Porsches use the same basic design language. In the days of David Lewis it was the same for B&O but now there is a "let's have another go" look about the range of products. It's always good if the customer or potential customer feels there's a plan.

Well, that's a good point, during both the Jensen and Lewis days, there was a lead designer who had authority to drive the bus so to speak, resulting in consistent design language across a range of products. Gave you the impression anyway that someone was coordinating things.

Jeff

I'm afraid I'm recovering from the BeoVirus. Sad

Simonbeo
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Simonbeo replied on Thu, Dec 21 2017 10:37 AM

Apple has a design figurehead. Tesla has a figurehead in the shape of Elon Musk. B&O did have somebody coordinating things. Now , the man from David Lewis is designing TVs for the company that provides the core of the Eclipse. How do you get a USP when it's available to others? There's even a speaker grille like the Horizon grille on both brands products.

Beo Century ,Beoplay V1, Beocenter 6, Ex-Beolit 12, Beotime , A8. Beolit 15 , Form 2i , Beolab 2000, Beoplay A3.Beosound 1

Aussie Michael
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Simonbeo:

Apple has a design figurehead. Tesla has a figurehead in the shape of Elon Musk. B&O did have somebody coordinating things. Now , the man from David Lewis is designing TVs for the company that provides the core of the Eclipse. How do you get a USP when it's available to others? There's even a speaker grille like the Horizon grille on both brands products.

Beo Century ,Beoplay V1, Beocenter 6, Ex-Beolit 12, Beotime , A8 , MX 5500 . Beolit 15 , Form 2i , Beolab 2000, Beoplay A3.

I too thought the LG was a B&O design
Millemissen
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Simonbeo:

Now , the man from David Lewis is designing TVs for the company that provides the core of the Eclipse.

I suppose, that you with ‘the man from David Lewis’ mean Torsten Valeur.

It’s been written before...

....Torsten Valeur is involved in the Signature series from LG - in the highend household hardware, that they make.

However - due to his contract with B&O - he has had nothing to do with what is called Signature in the audio/video department of LG.

http://www.lg.com/uk/lg-signature-products

MM

 

There is a tv - and there is a BV.

KMA
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KMA replied on Fri, Dec 22 2017 1:44 PM
Millemissen:

However - due to his contract with B&O - he has had nothing to do with what is called Signature in the audio/video department of LG.

http://www.lg.com/uk/lg-signature-products

MM

There is a tv - and there is a BV.

There is some conflicting information about this... my understanding is that Torsten was involved in the design of G6/G7 Signature OLED by LG.

However, perhaps that's not the case. I'll try to look up the source.

KMA

B&O product history since 1991: Ridiculously long to list in a signature.

Millemissen
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This is what Torsten wrote in a post in a previous theead:

Dear Beoworld friends.

MM is right, I have not been involved at all in the LG Signature TV design. 

We are an independent design consultancy and therefore work with different clients. However when it comes to audio and video my thoughts, creativity and hart is completely dedicated to Bang & Olufsen. 

I hope you will like what will be presented tomorrow.

 

BTW I can tell you that many of the big home entertainment companies also likes abang & Olufsen a lot.

 

Warm  greetings to you all,

torsten Valeur’

 

Have a look here:

http://forum.beoworld.org/forums/p/17934/156949.aspx#156949

MM

 

There is a tv - and there is a BV.

Thomas
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Thomas replied on Fri, Dec 22 2017 9:54 PM

I couldent agree more.

if Bang and Olufsen is to survive this is the way forward!

Format 0  😀😎

 

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