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May be this will bring good news for B&O?!

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ed7
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ed7 posted on Wed, Jan 22 2020 9:31 PM

Lots of unhappy Sonos customers 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-51206604

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StUrrock
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StUrrock replied on Wed, Jan 22 2020 11:02 PM

You are having a laugh!

At least the Sonos software worked!

I remember the BeoSound 5, every customer who bought one liked the look of it but hated the operation.

So that’s a 100% failure rate in my book.

Jeff
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Jeff replied on Wed, Jan 22 2020 11:16 PM

It points out one of the unfortunate things about the modern world, the hardware architecture becomes unable to support the complexity or features of new software. Like trying to run Microsoft Office on an old Commodore 64. Since the market thrives on and requires ever increasing options for improved performance or different features sooner or later a company will have to cut their losses and dump old platforms. This is made even worse for companies that didn't design in any buffer or excess capacity in their designs but cut corners so that they are barely functional when first released.

Not a lot of future proofing going on.

 

Jeff

I'm afraid I'm recovering from the BeoVirus. Sad

trackbeo
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The devil is in the details (of which there are none yet).  

@Begin(rant)  Had Sonos offered this "ancient/modern split-system OS fork" BEFORE they bricked all my CR100 controllers, I would have taken it!  Back then, it would have allowed customers to continue playing their own local music libraries, which is all they originally purchased/"bargained-for".  This would have been to the exclusion of new Sonos Play:N speakers, and many/most of the modern streaming services.  At that time, they decided not to fork, apparently in order to juice ongoing sales of new speakers at the expense of foisting updates onto their oldest customers.  It would be nice if this time were different.  One "devilish details" fear is that they will turn off the 30% trade-up discount for any customers who maintain their devices in legacy mode, forcing them to choose, before they see how (or how long) they can live with no updates.  

Aside, this is my problem with Roon also: when your subscription ends, or their company fails (or they simply change their minds on what they wish to provide) you don't get to keep the data you happen to have accrued about your local music library.  If your Roon license doesn't check in with their servers at least once a month, it stops working.  It won't even play your local music using their bare controller software without the licensed content.

Similar, but not as bad, is Dirac:  Calculations are performed on Dirac-owned servers, and your PC is merely a gathering-point for the input data and holding-point for Dirac's output calculated results.  (In some cases your holding-point ships Dirac's output results to another local device, e.g.MiniDSP.)  Yes, if Dirac goes under or changes their mind to increase profits, you might lose the ability to re-do the calculations based on new data -- but at least your local device will continue to apply the correction curve you have shipped to it, allowing your current speakers to continue performing in your current room, for as long as the hardware lasts!  @End(rant)

Stan
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Stan replied on Thu, Jan 23 2020 4:22 PM

While the current spotlight is on Sonos, as trackbeo's rant suggests, this is really an industry wide problem.  As long as your equipment requires some external entity to operate, you are at the mercy of this entity.  Because most external entities exist to generate a profit, at some point, this entity will decide that continued support for your device is economically unfavorable.  Some of us have already experienced this with the dropping of Spotify support in the BS5, as well as the dropping of the ML/NL converter.  All I can say is choose wisely and get used to it... or just enjoy your LPs and CDs and forget about this fancy tech.

Stan

Dillen
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Dillen replied on Thu, Jan 23 2020 4:58 PM

Very true.
I put a record on and press play.
No worries.

Martin

mm08642
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ed7:
May be this will bring good news for B&O?!

I do not think at all. Because Sonos listens to and communicates with their customers see https://blog.sonos.com/en/a-letter-from-our-ceo/ or the Sonos forum https://en.community.sonos.com. Not like Bang&Olufsen, they are completely indifferent to their customers.

koning
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trackbeo:

The devil is in the details (of which there are none yet).  

@Begin(rant)  Had Sonos offered this "ancient/modern split-system OS fork" BEFORE they bricked all my CR100 controllers, I would have taken it!  Back then, it would have allowed customers to continue playing their own local music libraries, which is all they originally purchased/"bargained-for".  This would have been to the exclusion of new Sonos Play:N speakers, and many/most of the modern streaming services.  At that time, they decided not to fork, apparently in order to juice ongoing sales of new speakers at the expense of foisting updates onto their oldest customers.  It would be nice if this time were different.  One "devilish details" fear is that they will turn off the 30% trade-up discount for any customers who maintain their devices in legacy mode, forcing them to choose, before they see how (or how long) they can live with no updates.  

Aside, this is my problem with Roon also: when your subscription ends, or their company fails (or they simply change their minds on what they wish to provide) you don't get to keep the data you happen to have accrued about your local music library.  If your Roon license doesn't check in with their servers at least once a month, it stops working.  It won't even play your local music using their bare controller software without the licensed content.

Similar, but not as bad, is Dirac:  Calculations are performed on Dirac-owned servers, and your PC is merely a gathering-point for the input data and holding-point for Dirac's output calculated results.  (In some cases your holding-point ships Dirac's output results to another local device, e.g.MiniDSP.)  Yes, if Dirac goes under or changes their mind to increase profits, you might lose the ability to re-do the calculations based on new data -- but at least your local device will continue to apply the correction curve you have shipped to it, allowing your current speakers to continue performing in your current room, for as long as the hardware lasts!  @End(rant)

 

Dirac works perfect in my Nad M10

But the Curve must be tweaked.

If you take the curve from Dirac the sound is boring.

 

 

 

 

Jaffrey2230
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I am assuming the hardware will keep working but won’t support the newer software features. No different than buying a 4K TV that won’t support Dolby Vision or some other standard because it is missing the hardware etc. This is par for the course I am afraid. The hardware still be able to do what it did when you bought it...

B&O products I use by zones in my home: 

Platform: Apple; TV/Office: Beolab 8002 (Red) + Beolab 2 [Sony 65A1E OLED TV, Apple TV 4K];  Living: Beoplay A9 (MK2); Bedroom: Beolab 6000 (Red) + Beolab 11 + Beosound Core [LG UST Projector, Apple TV 4K]; Dining: Beosound Stage; Portable: Beosound 1 (GVA, Anthracite), Beoplay P6, Beoplay H9 (3rd Gen)  

 

Chris Townsend
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https://youtu.be/FXE2yj87Rk0

Not good for anyone I guess. If it uses Bluetooth, can we assume it’ll still work as a stand-alone product without apps etc?

Beovision Eclipse, BeoLab 17,Beolit 15, Beoplay A2 Active

1990
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1990 replied on Mon, Feb 3 2020 10:47 AM

Luckily all B&O speakers have bluetooht and line-in, local control and remotes available. Cool

Sandyb
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Sandyb replied on Mon, Feb 3 2020 11:21 AM

The issue with the Sonos story is this - the older speakers that wont be updated anymore wil have to be used as standalone speakers.

So if you have a mix of supported / unsupported speakers, you have to split off the unsupported one(s) - then yes, they can work on a standalone basis.

But they cant be used in conjunction with newer ones, or as part of a mixed setup.

So its not quite the same as a 3 year old TV gaining no future software updates - the TV is generally standalone, and will continue that way, and an owner will largely be able to carry on as before.

The Sonos story means that for some their setups (whether all old, or a mix of old / new) is broken / needs breaking up.

 

 

Jaffrey2230:

I am assuming the hardware will keep working but won’t support the newer software features. No different than buying a 4K TV that won’t support Dolby Vision or some other standard because it is missing the hardware etc. This is par for the course I am afraid. The hardware still be able to do what it did when you bought it...

 

PaulGiles
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Not quite true?

From what we have been told is that they will still work together just not receive updates.

HH1971
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HH1971 replied on Sun, Feb 16 2020 10:25 AM

„May be this will bring good news for B&O“

I hope the Sonos customers are not so stupid to change to Bang & Olufsen!

Since Bang&Olufsen offers Multiroom systems (not based on Masterlink) there is not one product that Bang&Olufsen offered 11 years of software updates after introducing the product or 5 years of software updates after discontinuing the product. And looking at these 11 or 5 years of Sonos software update support, that is the worst situation. Most Sonos products have a much better software update lifetime.

Carolpa
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Carolpa replied on Sun, Feb 16 2020 12:36 PM

HH1971:
I hope the Sonos customers are not so stupid to change to Bang & Olufsen!
Hope you'r clever enough to sell your B&o ......to me for a small price. Stick out tongue

I prefer NL way over ML way over MCL!

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