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Beolab 50 and Turntables - Is the sound digitised

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Epsilon20
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Epsilon20 posted on Thu, Jun 27 2019 3:19 PM

Hi Guys, I've been offered a LINN Sondek LP12 at a great price to use with my Beolab 50s  and considering buying it however. The Beolab 50s and more recent speakers  as i understand it is a digital speaker and if i were to connect the turntable to the speakers via the phono in (first through a phono stage) the speaker would digitise the sound which takes away the whole reason of getting a Turnable /analogue source.

Am i correct in thinking that turntables with B&O systems of recent times 17s, 18s, 20,50's & 90s is pointless if you want an analogue sound? I hope not Crying 

I've already bought Vinyls and was about to pay for the Linn sondek which is an absolutely beautiful and great sounding turntable.

Beovision Eclipse 55 Brass Edition with Oak covers and Brass Orbital stand

Beolab 50s silver & Oak, Beolab 18 Brass with Smoked Oak, Beolab 18 Rose Gold with Maple Covers, Beolab 19 Black.

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DMacri
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DMacri replied on Sat, Jun 29 2019 12:17 PM
Jeff:

Jeff

I'm afraid I'm recovering from the BeoVirus.

Ok, I have to explain myself. So the BL50 is a system with an ADC front end for the analog inputs, a digital input feed, a DSP for applying signal modifications, a DAC to convert this all back to analog to feed the amplifiers, which in turn drive the speaker elements. I skipped over the electronic crossovers, but you get the point. So adding another external converter of any type is bound to damage the sound. Just feed the Beolab the best signal you can and you should be fine.

Now if you have a component of any type, it has to contend with the quality of the power supply, the signal it receives, and the environment it is in including heat from within in operation and the ambient air temperature. I am simply stating that a component designed for two input signals may respond a little better to having to process just one because the current demand would be lower, and there would be no influence from another signal to contend with - no cross-talk from the alternate signal channel. I could imagine the ADC to have better performance only half loaded. So maybe a tried and true ADC component running half of its capabilities is just fine and the circuit would not benefit from a higher spec chip running at a higher sample rate and/or bit depth.

Dom

2x BeoSystem 3, BeoSystem 5000, BeoSystem 6500, 2x BeoMaster 7000, 2 pair of BeoLab Penta mk2, AV 7000, Beolab 4000, BeoSound 4000, Playmaker, BeoLab 2500, S-45, S-45.2, RL-140, CX-50, C-75, 3x CX-100, 3x MCL2 link rooms, 3x Beolab 2000, M3, P2, Earset, A8 earphones, A3, 2x 4001 relay, H3, H3 ANC, H6, and ambio 

BEOVOX141
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@ DMacri

DMacri:
and there would be no influence from another signal to contend with - no cross-talk from the alternate signal channel

120dB is considered threshold of pain for sound.....

Mikipidia
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Iam not sure iam following but besides having amps the slave speaker is basically passive so iam not sure how you’d do this.

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Old: Beolab 1's, beolab 2, beovision 10-46, overture 2300, beolab 8000's, beolab 4000's, beovision avant 32" etc. etc.

BEOVOX141
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Mikipidia:
the slave speaker is basically passive

Where did you get that idea from  Confused  Please elaborate

Jeff
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Jeff replied on Sat, Jun 29 2019 2:02 PM

I follow the conversation Dom, I just am amazed at the lengths some people go to, not you, to argue about how many digital angels can dance on the head of a pin.

Jeff

I'm afraid I'm recovering from the BeoVirus. Sad

DMacri
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DMacri replied on Sat, Jun 29 2019 2:07 PM

Epsilon20:
Am i correct in thinking that turntables with B&O systems of recent times 17s, 18s, 20,50's & 90s is pointless if you want an analogue sound?

So I guess in the end the answer is "no, it is not pointless". You can route the analog signal from your LINN/preamp combination to the Beolabs, or use an outboard ADC, if you think it may provide superior performance, and route the digital signal to them. Either way, the original analog signal will be digitized, but that doesn't mean the signal will be altered so significantly in the process to ruin the experience.

Dom

2x BeoSystem 3, BeoSystem 5000, BeoSystem 6500, 2x BeoMaster 7000, 2 pair of BeoLab Penta mk2, AV 7000, Beolab 4000, BeoSound 4000, Playmaker, BeoLab 2500, S-45, S-45.2, RL-140, CX-50, C-75, 3x CX-100, 3x MCL2 link rooms, 3x Beolab 2000, M3, P2, Earset, A8 earphones, A3, 2x 4001 relay, H3, H3 ANC, H6, and ambio 

Mikipidia
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BEOVOX141:

Where did you get that idea from Please elaborate

The 50’s have one dsp(chip) for both speakers in the master speaker. So the master does all the computation, processing and room comp and then sends the finished signal of to the slave speaker.

The 90’s have a dsp chip in both speakers and each one does it’s own calculation and dsp stuff.

I meant to say that it’s passive in a computational sense, not in the old fashioned sense.

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Old: Beolab 1's, beolab 2, beovision 10-46, overture 2300, beolab 8000's, beolab 4000's, beovision avant 32" etc. etc.

Carolpa
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Epsilon20:
Am i correct in thinking that turntables with B&O systems of recent times 17s, 18s, 20,50's & 90s is pointless if you want an analogue sound?
And now the game changer, just a hypothesis: Epsilon20 wants to listen to jazz of the 50 of the last century. So he is buying new reissued albums.

In producing a reissue album, the original masters are digitalized, processed, etc. Finally a record is pressed.

But what is the point of this discussion (in this hypothesis) if he wants to experience vinyl if even the origin of the vinyl was digitalized!

BEOVOX141
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Mikipidia:
The 50’s have one dsp(chip) for both speakers in the master speaker

Based on the information in the technical sound guide, I find this very hard to believe.

Do you have anything that could support the claim?

poodleboy
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Carolpa:

Epsilon20:
Am i correct in thinking that turntables with B&O systems of recent times 17s, 18s, 20,50's & 90s is pointless if you want an analogue sound?
And now the game changer, just a hypothesis: Epsilon20 wants to listen to jazz of the 50 of the last century. So he is buying new reissued albums.

In producing a reissue album, the original masters are digitalized, processed, etc. Finally a record is pressed.

But what is the point of this discussion (in this hypothesis) if he wants to experience vinyl if even the origin of the vinyl was digitalized!

Amen, brother!!! If I remember correctly, the original demos of BeoLab 90 were done with Spotify tracks, and BeoLab 5 had their own demo CDs. I gave away many hundred records mainly because I was a partyophile vs an audiophile, and the warmth of my records (even with a nice system and many special masters) probably came from spilled drinks and cigarette smoke. Digital is good enough for me, and I only wish I could have a set of top BLs to prove it. 

Mikipidia
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Old: Beolab 1's, beolab 2, beovision 10-46, overture 2300, beolab 8000's, beolab 4000's, beovision avant 32" etc. etc.

Millemissen
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If someone wants ‘analog sound’, he should go to a venue, where music is played without amplification and processing.

If someone wants to listen to vinyl, he should do do so.....if he likes the sound and the handling of vinyl.

I guess listening on a set of the 50’es won’t diminish that experience for anyone.

MM

There is a tv - and there is a BV.

Millemissen
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BEOVOX141:

Mikipidia:
The 50’s have one dsp(chip) for both speakers in the master speaker

Based on the information in the technical sound guide, I find this very hard to believe.

Do you have anything that could support the claim?

Well, one is called master and the other slave.

MM

There is a tv - and there is a BV.

DMacri
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DMacri replied on Sat, Jun 29 2019 4:24 PM
I think that means there is one DSP per speaker, not per pair, right?

Dom

2x BeoSystem 3, BeoSystem 5000, BeoSystem 6500, 2x BeoMaster 7000, 2 pair of BeoLab Penta mk2, AV 7000, Beolab 4000, BeoSound 4000, Playmaker, BeoLab 2500, S-45, S-45.2, RL-140, CX-50, C-75, 3x CX-100, 3x MCL2 link rooms, 3x Beolab 2000, M3, P2, Earset, A8 earphones, A3, 2x 4001 relay, H3, H3 ANC, H6, and ambio 

BEOVOX141
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@ Miki

For starters.... From the white paper:

10.2.3

Digital Signal Processor Model Analog Devices ADSP-21489

Number 2  (my guess: two per speaker one for the room correction and one for the x-overs)

Instruction Rate 400 MHz Sampling rate 192 kHz (fixed)

Notes 32-bit floating point 


I dont see anything in the whitepaper supporting you claim, actuality I see a lot contradicting it, but since you own a pair and I dont you could be right.

I would just like to see some hard evidence showing the slave does not have a DSP.

Have you read the whitepaper ?

 

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