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Beogram 6002 strange sound

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carle621
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carle621 posted on Tue, May 23 2017 9:11 PM

I just bought an old Beogram 6002 very cheap. I have tested it, and everything works beautiful except for a strange sound. 

I wonder if the sound problem is due to a worn pickup? or an electronic problem:

Generally most records are very low on volume. But f.ex.  one specific record has a normal volume on both stereo channels, but the artist singing is very low in volume, only the accompanied music has a normal volume (on both channels!). The pickup is a SMMC4. It is too costly just to buy a new one for testing purposes :-( so I hope somebody might have some experience with worn pickups.

Carl

 

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beo3000
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Answered (Verified) beo3000 replied on Tue, May 23 2017 11:20 PM
Verified by carle621

most likely the cartridge, and its likely to be the suspension of it, 

 

http://www.audio-origin.co.uk/retipping-stylus.html

 

This way you can have the pickup tested before the refurbishment anyway.

 

best of luckBig Smile

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beo3000
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Answered (Verified) beo3000 replied on Tue, May 23 2017 11:20 PM
Verified by carle621

most likely the cartridge, and its likely to be the suspension of it, 

 

http://www.audio-origin.co.uk/retipping-stylus.html

 

This way you can have the pickup tested before the refurbishment anyway.

 

best of luckBig Smile

MediaBobNY
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It has a relatively new Soundsmith SMMC4, not an old OEM MMC-4.  So I'd rethink suspension degradation.  The problem might still be with the cartridge.  You need to either test it out on another B&O turntable or put a known working cartridge in your turntable to compare the sound.  Depending upon where you are you might find a Beoworld member willing to assist.  If the problem is the cartridge you should try to find out when it was purchased. Soundsmith offers a 1-year warranty.  If out of warranty they will repair it for just 20% of the original cost - which is cheaper than any alternative.  

 

 

 

solderon29
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Does'nt seem like a pu problem.What amplifier are you using,and how is it connected to the turntable?

Nick

carle621
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solderon29:

Does'nt seem like a pu problem.What amplifier are you using,and how is it connected to the turntable?

Nick

No I don't think its an amplifier problem. I changed the DIN-plug into Phono-plugs and connected it to my Denon amplifier, same input as used for another record player. So it might be an internal amplifier problem in the beogram6002, but not externally.

Tks for reply

Carl

 

Dillen
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Dillen replied on Wed, May 24 2017 8:28 PM

carle621:

So it might be an internal amplifier problem in the beogram6002, but not externally.

There isn't one.
There are no electronics in the signal path in Beogram 6002.
There's the MMC cartridge, wires and the DIN socket. That's all.
(And a muting relay, but it cannot break the signals - merely short them to ground). 

Martin

solderon29
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As Martin assert's,there is no pre-amp in the deck,but the wiring between the pu via the arm etc is very fine wire which connects to a ribbon board,and then on to the output socket assembly

I had a weird problem like this once,where the signal ground was missing(no hum tho!)and the sound was sort of "out of phase" as you describe!!

.Does your '6002 also have RCA(phono) sockets,not all types did?

Are you sure of your connections into the new RCA phono connections?Can't go wrong really,but you never know?How did you connect the outer(chassis) ground connection?

The B&O pu will seem quiet through a third party amplifier,as they are obviously optimised for use with compatible B&O product.

Nick

 

carle621
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Thank you very much to everybody, especially Nick and Martin, for your answers, it has taken me a bit closer to the main problem. On the diagram I can see the connections via the muting relay, and I suspect this relay to be the problem:

- First of all, no I have only a din-plug, no phono ! I have tested the cable from the din-plug to my phono plugs, and it is OK

- I disconnected the cartridge, and measured from each of the 4 pins to the left and the right channel on the phono plugs, and some very strange results showed up: 

- From the black phono plug I measured a resistance of only 3-4 ohm to ALL four pins in the arm!! That was also the case when measuring from the red phono plug to all four pins!!

There was NO connection to the ground on the phono plugs from any of the four pins, which according to the diagram cannot happen, because it is wired straight through internally in the relay??

Before I dismantle the whole deck, I would very much like to heay if you might have a good explanation to my measurements

 Carl

 

sonavor
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The four cartridge connector pads map to pins 3, 5 and 2 on the phono DIN plug.  Those pins (3, 5 and 2) should measure as shorted together when the Beogram is off. When it is on you should see an open between them. 

-sonavor

 

carle621
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OK, got it. Yes I can understand that pin 3 and 5 is shorted to pin 2 (ground) when the relay is "on", but I cannot understand why I cannot measure connection (around 3-4 ohms) from the "ground pins" in the arm to pin nr 2 in the din socket (the ground pin) ??

carl

 

sonavor
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I see. I didn't understand that you are saying your phono cartridge low side connections (left L and right L) were not making it to pin 2 of the DIN plug. You are measuring an open circuit for those to pin 2 of the DIN plug then? If that is the case then you have a wiring problem. Those connections are always there whether the Beogram is playing or not. The muting relay just routes the phono high signals to the low for the mute operation so I would not suspect the relay in your problem. Perhaps someone tampered with the Beogram in the past and resulted in the wires breaking. You may have to open the Beogram into service position to trace down the problem. If you haven't ever opened up that type of Beogram you must be careful. It is easy to damage things if you don't properly release and maneuver the floating chassis.

-sonavor 

carle621
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Thank you, yes I also believe it is a wiring problem. So maybe I have a fine working pickup :-)

I have never opened a Beogram before, so I will se if I can find somebody to help me out.

Thanks again for your help

Carl

 

sonavor
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I work on Beogram 400x and 800x turntables so I haven't opened a Beogram 6002 either.

-sonavor

carle621
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carle621 replied on Wed, Aug 16 2017 11:58 AM

The problem has been found and corrected :-)) It is very strange, and it looks to me like this Beogram has left the factory without being tested.

The reason was that the ground pin in the DIN female plug inside the Beogram, pin number 2, was simply missing, and therefore the reference ground was not connected to the cable, giving this very very weird problem.

I connected the ground wire to the chassis ground, and voila, everything is now working so beautiful. Probably the cartridge is brand new, because it must have been impossible to get any tone out of it previously.

Thanks for all the answers, it has been so helpful. 

Carl

 

jenku
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jenku replied on Wed, Jan 30 2019 2:23 PM

Hey Carl621

I know it's been a couple of years since You posted this about Your Beogram 6002.

I have this problem.

The four wires to the platter motor are broken off.

Do You by any means have an idea where the wires are soldered to the platter motor PCB?

Regards

jenku

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