BeoLab 9 Overhaul, Crackling SOLVED

29 replies

You can arque about the response from B&O but they don't offer diagrams from all the products since 200x or so.
However they offer a replacement chassis (referred by you as PCB999) they repaired and checked themselves.

It's probably the most reliable solution and above all the quickest solution for the customer, they think.

Location: Utrecht

Quite a challenge to achieve "Less is More" while having the Beovirus.

Beobuddy wrote:

It's probably the most reliable solution

I'll warrant that my repair is more reliable than an original (even if new) exchange module.

Those original SMD capacitors are incredibly unreliable, and after having been replaced by regular High-quality leaded units, this unit will outlast an original B&O exchange module.

Not to mention that I reflowed all the SMD joints with LEADED solder - that alone will add years to its life, when compared to the junk unleaded solder used originally.

Location: Jerusalem

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Electronics Technician in Jerusalem Israel. B&O fan for over 50 years.

Menahem Yachad wrote:

I'll warrant that my repair is more reliable than an original (even if new) exchange module.

To claim that a board reworked by you is more reliable than one refurbished by the original manufacturer - or even a new original.
That is some statement. 

You found the problem and you repaired the product. That's fine.

You are entitled to your opinion, and you and I have not always agreed.

Menahem Yachad wrote:

Not to mention that I reflowed all the SMD joints with LEADED solder - that alone will add years to its life, when compared to the junk unleaded solder used originally.

If we talk about stability, I don't agree to mixing leaded and unleaded solder types.
They have different eutectic properties.
The risk of fatigue and cracking is high.
I certainly wouldn't do it in a product like a speaker, considering the vibrations in there for hours every day.
Did you see many problems with the unleaded solder used in B&Os products (or elsewhere)? And which problems?

Menahem Yachad wrote:

... and after having been replaced by regular High-quality leaded units, this unit will outlast an original B&O exchange module.

Some of the same issues apply to fitting components with leads in place of SMDs.
Not in vibrating environment like this, unless some form of physical relief can be introduced and all old solder can be removed and replaced by a good solder containing a little silver to prevent fatigue.

Menahem Yachad wrote:

Those original SMD capacitors are incredibly unreliable, and after having been replaced by regular High-quality leaded units, this unit will outlast an original B&O exchange module.

I never had more problems with SMD capacitors that I had with ones with leads.
Did you have many problems with the original SMD capacitors?
May I ask what problems and in which products?

I understand, that the problem actually wasn't capacitor-related here.

 

Edit:

In my first post for this reply I asked if there was any chance you could show us your workspace and tools?
With all the talk about reliability I was particularly interested in knowing which ESD-precautions you have taken.

Now, looking again, I found your photo in the first post (and subsequent),...

Please tell me that is NOT a plastic table???

With circuit boards lying directly on top of it???
With plastic parts, plastic cups and plastic tools all around?

What's that on the floor? A carpet? In an electronic repairshop?

And your other table - is that laminate?

I spot no ESD-precautions whatsoever!

Quite contrary in fact.

Martin

Martin,

You're right - it is some statement, and I'll stand by it.

My workshop organization, cleanliness, environment, workmanship, ability and attention to detail is far above any norm, and the results show.

It would also exceed any critical industrial standards, even though I have no need or intention of applying for certification.

After working in the Israeli electronic industry, arguably among the most advanced in the world (based on the equipment we are proud to produce and export world-wide), I learnt what a proper electronics workshop should be, and I duplicated it in my own workshop.

Based on what I've seen on YouTube technician videos, I also realize that not many technicians have the privilege of creating an ideal workshop like mine.

It may be difficult for you to accept, but I really don't need anyone's approval, other than that of my customers worldwide.

I'll address your related concerns further down

 

It's common knowledge that B&O had quality issues in the past, and they've done a great job at attempting to solve them, evidenced at least by the good quality of some of the components in these PCB's.

However, every one of the SMD caps on the Black ICEPower PCB was far off-spec, measuring the ESR and capacitance out-of-circuit after removal.

I expected that, and the replacement of those caps, solved the Orange light overheating problem.

So, at least on this machine, that is evidence of failure-prone SMD caps.

 

It's a well known problem that during the SMD PCB manufacturing cycles of Preheat and Flow, the Electrolytic caps take a beating at those temperatures.

SMD caps are subjected to destructive heat cycles which Leaded caps were never subjected to.

And current Electrolytic chemical technology does not yet have a solution for that.

So, it stands to reason that any SMD cap, no matter the make, starts off its life partially crippled.

 

For at least 40 years, my solder of choice is Kester 245. I have 2 versions - one 63/37 and 62/36/2.

They meet all the requirements for my varied applications.

 

If we're talking about vibrations, my goodness, then what is Unleaded solder doing on these PCB's?

Unleaded solder barely manages to keep from cracking under even the best conditions.

If vibration is a valid argument, then that should be a good enough reason to forbid the use of Unleaded solder on these PCB's.

 

Since you ask about problems with SMD capacitors, let me throw a four-letter word in here. B-se.

I have repaired literally HUNDREDS of B-se Wave PCB's, ALL with failed SMD capacitors.

It is an absolute reliability disaster, and an insult to the customers for the prices they ask.

There are probably other manufacturers just as bad, but I can speak only from my personal experience.

 

The BL9's were opened on our spare table - plastic, simply to spread out the parts, which were then taken into my workshop, as required.

At that stage, I was certainly not concerned about ESD.

That photo is NOT in my workshop.

We do NOT own any carpets - not sure where you got that from. Carpets are not common in Israeli homes.

I don't see any need to post any photos of my workshop, apart from that on my

Location: Jerusalem

My B&O Icons:

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Electronics Technician in Jerusalem Israel. B&O fan for over 50 years.

Duplicate Post

Location: Jerusalem

My B&O Icons:

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Electronics Technician in Jerusalem Israel. B&O fan for over 50 years.

The final culprits were the 2 ICs that was replaced? 

A quick summary of the solution:

 

Orange light (solved first):

Replacement of some capacitors and one carbon resistor on the PSU PCB, as shown above

Replacement of all SMD Electrolytics on all 3 PCB's in the PCB999 module.

 

Crackling (solved last):

Replacement of 2 MC33079 Quad OpAmps on PCB1 - the Crossover PCB (inside PCB999 module).

This does NOT imply that replacing IC203 and IC204 in all defective BL9's will solve the problem, but it does point to a possibility that any or some MC33079 OpAmps may develop faults. So ALL MC33079's on PCB1 should be checked with a scope, in order to determine whether defective.

Location: Jerusalem

My B&O Icons:

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Electronics Technician in Jerusalem Israel. B&O fan for over 50 years.

Will the ic be the cause of the orange light and not the caps? 

Teyelvis wrote:

Will the ic be the cause of the orange light and not the caps? 

Absolutely Not!

Those IC's are in the Audio Circuit only.

 

Also proof is that immediately AFTER the capacitor replacement, the Orange light problem disappeared.

At that point, I had not yet started any troubleshooting on the IC's, and the crackling was still present.

 

Therefore I can conclude beyond doubt, that the Orange light problem was related to the capacitors, and the Crackling was related to the IC's.

 

I hope that makes it clear ;-)

Location: Jerusalem

My B&O Icons:

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Electronics Technician in Jerusalem Israel. B&O fan for over 50 years.
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