Just a very quick update that might help with any best guess diagnosis - with the turntable upside down and the base cover off, i.e. looking down through the relay window, when I press LIFT I can see the uppermost contact flip across a couple of millimetres, followed by a small spark. Is this spark normal? Doesn't seem right to me.

IMPORTANTLY : I also hear a humming noise and can see the rotor through the motor grill try to move but doesn't go on to rotate, almost as if it's jammed but I know that it isn't. NB: While checking all this the drive belt was removed.

I thought I had sorted out the 'power to the motor' issue by re-connecting the wires running into the white (mains power) terminal block. I now can't help feel there was nothing wrong with my initial wiring and that the fault lies with the relay? This feeling is further advanced because the power supply issue has been an intermittent problem over several days, i.e. sometimes the motor works, sometimes it doesn't.

I realise it's next to impossible to diagnose from a distance but your best thoughts will be much appreciated. I'm sure I will need an electrician / technician at some point. 

Thank you, Carl

Update 1.5 hrs later (I figure it is best to provide current situation).

Regarding the relay contact and subsequent spark I mention above, plus the associated motor not running, I have just pushed the plastic black arm that is connected to the uppermost rotor contact, away from the centre spindle cam. It clicked into that 'away' position and stayed there. Now when I power on the turntable at the mains the platter rotates without me having to press the LIFT button. If nothing else this confirms I am getting power to the motor so there cannot be any problems with my connections into the white 'mains power' terminal block.

I disconnected from the mains to stop the platter spinning and put on a record. Plugged back in and the platter rotates immediately. However the pickup arm stays in its rest position. I have to do several presses of the LIFT button before the pickup arm moves over to the start of the record. It drops onto the record but only barely (I think I need to check the pickup arm weight settings as it may be too light at the stylus end).

Half way through the record I tried pressing LIFT. It needed several presses but eventually the pickup arm raised, but only slightly, it was barely clear of the record. The platter kept spinning though.

Once the 'end of record' was reached the pickup arm just stayed in the end grooves, jumping back and forth. I had to manually place it back in its rest position with the platter still spinning.  As so many times now, in order to stop the platter I had to turn off at the mains.

I'm tired now so tomorrow I will adjust the 'start' and 'end' of record positions using the screw adjustments as provided.

But I'm still no where near close to understanding what's actually going on and why the LIFT button doesn't seem to talk properly with the relay. In fact I don't think there is anything wrong with the LIFT button. My gut feel is there is something amiss with the relay itself, and possibly something not right with the centre spindle cam, but prior to moving the arm as detailed above I haven't touched this area at all.

A challenge indeed. Thanks all, Carl

Hi All,

Other than Martin (Dillen) and matador43 I'm not sure who else has been following my Beogram 2000 renovation. However I thought I'd share my most recent work because it's been quite a successful day today.

Firstly, in my last reply above I stated 'rotor contact' - I did of course mean 'relay contact' - sorry for any confusion.

For full context you'd need to read the complete thread, but in summary:

I had previously rebuilt the motor, replaced the LIFT button assembly, reset the drive cone to Service Manual spec and installed a new belt. 

Then I ran into some unexpected problems which I list bellow. I assumed, with some bemusement, that this work I had done was responsible for these unexpected problems. However, I think I can say that these unexpected problems do not seem to be related with my previous work (at least as far as I can tell).

Unexpected problems were:

• Motor would start immediately I plugged the turntable into the mains and wouldn't stop when I pressed LIFT (I had to keep turning off at the mains), OR, the motor wouldn't start when I plugged in and pressed LIFT. These two outcomes depended on the position of the top armature coming out of the relay (by top I mean as seen with turntable upside down). If I pulled the armature away, i.e. past the point where it could swing freely then the motor started when I plugged into the mains, if I put the armature back in its proper position then the motor didn't start at all. Caveat - I'm sure a more experienced person would NOT have pulled the armature back like I did, but for me it was trial and error.

• Spark coming from relay unit when I pressed LIFT (top armature contact point). I cant remember what position I had the armature in when this kept happening.

• Pickup arm would not move from its starting rest position with platter spinning.

• Pickup arm would not return to its rest position after reaching end of record. 

• Pickup up would barely rise from the record when LIFT pressed half way through playing. Sometimes it didn't rise at all. On the occasions when it did rise a little and I put it back in its rest position, the platter kept spinning.

Following my work today:

• Only one problem remaining, that being that the pickup arm doesn't rise during playing when LIFT is pressed.

Here is what I did. NB: The technicians out there will undoubtedly identify what remedial action is more likely connected to solving my problems, but for me it is hard to pin point anything in particular. I just did as much as I could while it was all apart.

• Meticulously adjusted micro switch contact points (below LIFT button). Also re-cleaned these contact points.

• Removed relay from base. Dismantled it. Cleaned all solder and dual contact points with IPA. Cleaned other parts with dry swabs. Cleaned plastic housing. One of my reasons for doing this was to remove the Kontact 60 that I had previously and mistakenly sprayed into the housing inspection window.

• Re-assembled relay and using approximation (just as an interim), reset the dual contact points in accordance with the service manual.

• Cleaned and lubricated around silent switch area (I used Kontact 60).

• Cleaned and lubricated pickup arm pivot area (it was not very dirty).

• Removed lifting cam. Checked for anything broken (all looked ok). Cleaned and lubricated area including spindle.

• Replaced lifting cam making sure I found the correct '0' position, i.e. when pickup arm lifts after turning lifting cam manually.

• Reset dual contact points in the relay using the service manual guidelines, i.e. when up against specified lifting cam positions. I found this really difficult because my close up eye sight is not great, and I have yet to master holding a magnifying glass, torch and tiny screwdriver all at the same time!

Voila - there you have it, everything is now ok - Apart from LIFT not working during record playing, the reasons for which I am not sure. I checked under the lifting cam and the thin metal rod, which I believe is the pickup arm lifting mechanism, seemed ok. Everything was in its correct place so far as I could see.

If any suggestions on why pressing LIFT during play doesn't raise the pickup arm then they'd be gratefully received!

Which of these jobs solved all but one of my problems is not known to me. I expect it was a combination, with the relay being a major contributor. I'm certainly not suggesting you do all this, and I'm even more certain that I'm in no position to be advising.

Perhaps a technician could comment on what work you should prioritise should you have similar issues to me. If the answer is 'none' then I'm ok with that (smile).

Hope to receive some pick up arm raise remedies/suggestions.

Thank you, Carl

Hi,

I'm wondering if there is a certain way the lifting cam on my Beogram 2000 Type 5240 has to be installed, i.e. so that the plastic & metal swivel bits & pieces on the underside of the lifting cam, are engaged properly. Also, so that the pickup arm lifting mechanism located on the base (thin metal rod with a white round 'runner' bearing at the end), is engaged properly. 

Do these cam pieces and lifting arm mechanism need to be set in a certain position before placing the lifting cam on its centre spindle? Should other parts be set in a certain position, i.e. the spindle itself etc. And should the drive belt be removed or left on? If left on should the platter 'speed selector' be set in a specific position?

My lifting cam has already been taken off and put back on. All seems ok apart from the pickup arm doesn't raise when i press the LIFT button whilst playing a record. 

This fault may be due to something else but I thought it sensible to try and eliminate any installation errors when I refitted my lifting cam.

I've searched the service manual and Forum's and found some useful information, but as yet I've found nothing that answers my specific query.

It doesn't help that the lifting cam is opaque, you cant see whats going on underneath! 

Many thanks for your help, Carl

Yes, the arms etc. that grips into the cam wheel will have to sit in their respective tracks.
The smaller arms and actuators on the cam itself will automatically correct. (NEVER lubricate the small arms on the cam - they will only work correctly when dry and "lose").

At some point, a B&O tech note suggested substituting of the original cam wheels for certain models.
I don't recall which models or why, and I don't have my notes here, but I will see if I can look it up.

Martin

Oops - I had better take off the lifting cam quickly and clean off the lubricant i'd put on.

Will be interesting to know if my model will benefit from one of these substitute cams.

Thank you Martin.

Well, it's time for a brief update.

But just as a reminder: Yesterday I had everything working other than being able to raise the pickup arm while the record was playing (via the LIFT button). Pressing LIFT during play did nothing. Otherwise on my initial pressing of LIFT, the platter got up to speed quickly, the pickup arm moved over the start position of the record, it lowered, played the whole record, pickup arm lifted at end of record and returned to its resting position. All done automatically and without fault. 

Today I decided to remove the lifting cam once again so as to remove the lubricant I had mistakenly applied to the plastic and metal parts of its underside. I washed the lifting cam in a degreaser and let it air dry in the sun for 3+ hours.

After refitting the cam I ran another test. This time the platter got up to speed quickly (just as yesterday) and the pickup arm moved over to the start of the record. However, on the pickup arm lowering to the record the platter stopped (I could hear that the motor spindle had stopped spinning). I pressed the LIFT button expecting nothing to happen (as was the case yesterday), yet this time the motor started up again and the pickup arm raised, followed by the motor stopping - just as it should do.

Strange I thought? - yesterday the whole record played but LIFT did not raise the pickup arm during play. Today whole record doesn't play but LIFT does raise the pickup arm when lowered onto the record. The only thing that has changed between today and yesterday in the removal, cleaning and refitting of the lifting cam.

My current suspicions are that there is a fault with the lifting cam (although I can't see anything broken), or more likely I am not fitting it correctly. I've checked the relay armatures and they position themselves correctly into the cam (so far as I can tell). The only other remaining possibility is a little person keeps running into the room behind my back, and each time changes something different!!

Oh well, I'll keep trying. Maybe tomorrow I'll refit the cam and see what that does.

Rgds, Carl 

Arms come out of one end of the start relay box.
A small wire spring should sit right where they come out.
Is this spring present?

Hi Martin,

Have taken a photo. Is this the area you refer to?

I don't recall seeing or losing a spring at any time.

When I removed the relay for cleaning it went back exactly as I found it. If the photo is the area you refer to and it doesn't show a required spring then it was lost long before I removed the relay and lifting cam.

Many thanks for getting back.