i've posted at beoworld since c. 2003 ( the good olde daze ) and i've never spent a penny on membership fees , so i don't know what point you're trying to make about posters being strong armed into buying stuff

makes this site the bargain of the century i guess ! 

The subscription you pay gives you access to the extensive manual section and automatic entry into the monthly draw.

You could (and would) have received exactly the same service and advise were you a bronze member (i.e. free), as Flappo points out. You can also join the monthly draw by application each month without paying the subscription if you wish. Most here pay the subscription to ensure the long term viability of the site, I certainly wasn't "herded" or pressured to subscribe.

(btw the original "free" site charged a fee to join the "Connoisseurs Club" where the maunals were stored, and regularly touted for donations to keep the site alive and so wasn't, in fact, free at all! If you join here as a Silver member you have all the same benefits of a "Connoisseur", without being asked for additional contributions throughout the year).

There are obvious expenses involved in running the site, it is maintained and hosted by professionals. (Those that remember the old site will also remember the frequent and frustrating downtime caused by poor hosting).

Additionally there are many, long term, members here who deal openly in second hand B&O without issue which would suggest to me that perhaps there were other issues involved in the case you highlight.

On the whole I don't see why you feel the need to have a go at the site or it's administration. I for one am always impressed by the fair and professional manner in which the site is run.

I have deleted the last couple of posts on this thread. This site is on the whole frequented by intelligent and generous individuals. I can understand strong emotions can be stirred by certain posts but please do not rise to these and post gratuitous insults.

Not to be flip about it, but it was exciting while it lasted.  Although I know this thread stirred up a lot of passion and emotion in the membership, I must say as a neutral observer I did find the discussion both honest and frank.  I have to say that I think it is really a testament to BeoWorld that it was allowed to happen in the first place and that it was allowed to last so long in the second.

Back to the music?

Tom

Well I have made a new friend through this site, Flappo the Grate, so I am extremely grateful for that. He is a 38 year old female from Uganda ( see

Actually you don't seem to voice any of my thoughts at all. I personally find there is a big difference between honesty and rudeness. Clearly the line between them is something we all must find and decide. I am sorry that you have decided to leave Beoworld and hope that you have benefitted from some of the advice you have sought. This is essentially an information site and tries its best to avoid personal slurs so that all members can gain without being made to feel inferior or superior to anyone else. A lot of members on this site are actually extremely wealthy but give their time freely. Others have to save to indulge their passion for B&O. All in my view are equally valuable to this site and add to the extremely friendly nature of this site.

I will, at your request, delete your membership immediately. 

 for further details) whose only interest in life is to be abusive through a number of online portals. My life would have been so empty without him, so a big thank you to Beoworld for that.

It has been fun and I know that I voice a great many views that people have but might not say. I like saying them because its honest and straight to the point, a Greek trait and one that I am proud of. All the best.

Simon.

????

 Having read this thread with interest, I will declare here and now that I do indeed have a vested interest.

I own a B&O franchise in Manchester.  I ran a couple of events instore that some folks from these boards have attended.  I would like to think that everyone had an enjoyable visit, and that they were not unduly pressured into buying anything - (you'd have to ask them )  although bear in mind that it is, after all, a shop😕 )  What I would say is it was an honour to host both events, and everyone who attended was a warm & friendly person - no exceptions.  But - I do use my shops name as a username here, so I suppose that is a form of advertising.  I have publicised a couple of evening - we even hosted a BeoWorld Prize Draw.  So, maybe I "used" the site for financial gain.

However - I can assure The Bionic Man that if Lee ( or anyone else ) wanted to cynically obtain ££'s via a website, there are far easier / more lucrative ways to do so - the level of detail, care, time, interest etc that is put into the BeoBrand via this site is way ahead of the bare minimum that could be done for similar financial return.

So the only possible conclusion is that extra time & effort is done willingly, for the shared benefit of the other members.  Not be all dewey -eyed about it - this is a great "fan site", but the reality is that Lee has overheads, and a living to make, so there needs to be some income - but to accuse the founder/members/mods of this site in such a way is simply not fair.  I am fairly sure that Beoworld alone would not even pay minimum-wage if it was a full time job - so why be so negative ??

Greek or not - what's with the aggression? I don't see that as fortright or candid at all. Just stirring the pot? Or arguing over how many angels fit on the head of a pin?

You write: There is no doubt that Beoworld is a serious threat to the official B&O dealers and while some support it I know most don't. There is the fear that wrong information is spread through the forum and this ultimately always comes back to the dealer to have to explain and put right.

How on earth can BeoWorld be a threat to the official B&O dealers? Wrong information? B&O are free to correct whatever information is entered here, immediately, as are all the dealers. If someone here points out that things could be better, or that a B&O solution may not be top notch, then that information is not wrong -- it may be inconvenient, but it could also be the truth. If not - correct it.
And B&O should thank its lucky stars that someone bothers with BeoWorld. Post a question at the official site and you'll get a pretty useless answer, after a long wait; post it here, and you'll get an informed one in a few minutes - which matches marketing claims against real world experiences. (In comparison, the B&O Wednesday chat sessions that Coolskin likes to post read like an absurd play by Pirandello.)
People are getting their systems working with ten minutes of assistance here, and are often spared having to wait for dealers to come and correct the problem.

This site practises instant correction or emendation. Just the other day I suggested that the Beomaster 6500 was one of the finest amp's in the stackable range, Peter voiced his doubts and raised the 5000 to championship level. That's how an enthusiasts' site works. Evaluate the information, consider it, do what you will with it.

B&O needs BeoWorld -- all premium brands need to have a strong and enthusiastic fan base, often critical and often reverential of what the brand's up to. Any brand that thinks it can operate in today's web connected world without giving its fans an independent voice is doomed to a hard time.

And isn't your example, which I have quoted above, actually the very proof you seek that BeoWorld is independent of B&O?

(Written by someone who's had extensive dealings with and contacts with B&O, but who is not presently directly involved with the company!)
 

Actually Beoworld runs at a loss. The subscriptions come nowhere near to covering the cost of running the site and it is only the small amount of advertising on the main site that makes us come close to solvency. No-one at Beoworld draws any money from the site - all the moderators are unpaid and always have been. The only person who has ever made any money from this site was the original owner.

There are a number of B&O dealers on site - and they are most welcome. Some are happy to post under their real name and others post under pseudonyms. Many offer excellent advice to other members on here and we are most grateful for this.

In addition, there are a number of re-sellers on site. They do not advertise on site as we have tried to make this site free of advertising as far as possible. You will notice that there is no advertising on the forum at all. This has caused some disagreements in the past and I dare say is not universally popular. However those of us who can remember the old B&O Message Board will remember that this became unusable due to unregulated advertising.  

There are other B&O sites but I think this one offers the friendliest atmosphere as well as the quickest and most helpful answers available.  Despite insinuations to the contrary, we are independent of B&O though clearly, as an enthusiast site,  we try not to damage the interests of B&O. We are not above criticising though and I believe that B&O value some of the more forthright posters opinions.

I will personally support the freedom of anyone to speak their mind as long as it is not insulting or damaging. If you have complaints about the site or any member, whether they be a new member or a moderator, do approach one of the moderators and we will try to address your concerns.

 

Across the internet there are many forums that are run by honest individuals with no ulterior motive that to help other individuals.

I am not a moderator here, but I am a moderator on a forum for children and adults with  Autism and their families and carers. You could say that I have a vested interest in that two of my children are on the Autistic Spectrum and it helps me to have that interchange of ideas witrh parents, but I give my time freely and if there is any potential for reward from moderating the forum  I am at a loss to think what it might be. The forum is enturely financed by the people who orginally set it up who have refused my repeated offers of financial assistance and the forum carries no advertising of any kind.

Likewise I have always felt that the people running this form are first and foremost B&O enthuiasts and they give their time freely becuase of that enthusiasm  and because there are some good people here. I would also suggest that if Lee is doing this to  make money he could find more efficient ways of doing it as I would guess that Lee doesn't make any money at all from Beoworld and the value of prizes probably exceeds subscription revenue by some margin.

I think  it sad that some people find it so hard to accept that there are good people out there who will do 'something for nothing', in that sense Beoworld is typical of many forums out there, and I am at a loss to understand why it has been singled out for all this unproductive sniping.

Simon