soundproof wrote:

  All that said - I would still place a sensible DAC between my digital sources and good speakers.

Agreed!

soundproof wrote:

  And as B&O speakers have built-in amplifiers, that decision is a no-brainer.

Yes and No!

For sure there are differences between the DAC chips - but the largest differences in sound still happen in analogue output stage
of the converters where "old fashioned virtues" like stable & clean powersupply count ...

tournedos wrote:

maclife wrote:

But other people did open the AirPort Express, the result is here:

http://www.vonwentzel.net/ABS/Dissection-Express/

The model in question is the first generation of an AirPort Express base, so its contents might have changed since. But in this generation a Burr-Brown PCM2705 DAC has been used, a component you find in many other products as indicated here:

http://www.head-fi.org/t/325941/all-the-dacs-money-can-buy-pt-2

It might be quite funny if you replace the internal DAC of an AirPort Express base by an external DAC with the same components …

All true, but the DAC chip is just the DAC chip, it doesn't make up the entire device. There are plenty of opportunities to ruin the sound with circuitry around it, be it a badly/cheaply designed audio buffer stage, a badly/cheaply designed designed power supply, or inadequate PCB layout for whatever reason.

For being able to discuss this in a serious form we unfortunately would need to really compare such devices in detail on a piece by piece level.

As the (somehow) inferior audio quality of the AE has been reported and confirmed by a number of sources - including many Apple advocates - I have no reason to believe it wasn't like that, although I have never heard one. The majority of the intended audience would never know or care.

I’m honestly not aware of such sources but would be very interested in getting more details as it always helps having an information advantage.

As stated, look at the price. Even if the price included the usual Apple markup, it would still be a very cheap device. Whoever designed it will have had to consider every single $0.01 resistor, whether to include it or not.

This could be true – or not. As Apple has the tendency of incredibly long product cycles for its accessories and are selling huge quantities in the same time, they easily could dictate prices for every part in a much more comfortable way small high fidelity companies would be able.

as linn says source first ,if you loose the information at the start of the chain,you cant gain it back,24bit studio masters from linn records 100% sound better than the cd version.Just heard lab 5s with a linn klimax ds playing 24bit file and it was awesome, compared to the same cd from a beosound 9000 cd player.

This does not mean much to me but there is a teardown of the latest AE link . 

The author says of the DAC: "The audio digital to analog converter is an all-new 24-bit/192khz . This chip is similar to the Cirrus Logic CS4344 used in the previous model, but should be an improvement over the Burr-Brown PCM2705 used in the original 802.11g Airport Expresses."

Hardwriter wrote:

Before the anti-Mac brigade kick off I should also point out the teardown was carried out by a company that plays in the OSX market, which may introduce a little bias into its judgement of the overall quality of the AE device.

Having said that, after Rogue Amoeba's recent run-ins with Apple, I don't know how much in favour they are, these days. Sounds like they've upgraded the DAC though, which is good - 24-bit. 

Now I just need to go and re-rip all my Spice Girls CDs in to lossless 24-bit, 'eh? :) Oh the immense joy I'll have picking out the nuances in the audio I didn't previously hear in CD quality 16-bit.

moxxey wrote:

Now I just need to go and re-rip all my Spice Girls CDs in to lossless 24-bit, 'eh? :) Oh the immense joy I'll have picking out the nuances in the audio I didn't previously hear in CD quality 16-bit.

On the subject of nuances in the audio, I occasionally listen to music via a pair of quality earphones and am always amazed by what I am now able hear compared to 'normal' loudspeaker listening.

In the case of tracks/albums I have purchased and listened to quite a bit, when I then listen to the same ones with the earphones,  often it's almost like I'm listening to a different recording as the differences are so marked. 

I think a lot of people who obsess about the technology of the recording and reproductive process would be better off saving their money and  just listening via headphones occasionally and enjoying the enormous improvement in the listening experience.   

kokomo wrote:

On the subject of nuances in the audio, I occasionally listen to music via a pair of quality earphones and am always amazed by what I am now able hear compared to 'normal' loudspeaker listening.

In the case of tracks/albums I have purchased and listened to quite a bit, when I then listen to the same ones with the earphones,  often it's almost like I'm listening to a different recording as the differences are so marked. 

I think a lot of people who obsess about the technology of the recording and reproductive process would be better off saving their money and  just listening via headphones occasionally and enjoying the enormous improvement in the listening experience.   

I can see what you're saying but then listening on headphones does not give you the true stereo experience, instead you get the "through-head" experience. You would need either binaural recordings (uncommon) or an external binaural processor to simulate the sound bleed/reflection  around the head normally experienced in stereo listening.

I do like listening on headphones and you are correct, they do enable you to hear detail more clearly - this is ideal for spotting problems when mixing or producing music.

Carolpa its what we call irony.

Chris Townsend wrote:

Carolpa its what we call irony.

it would be irony if he did know were he was talking about. I would call it teasing.