Dkatz, from now you can leave out Nokia as an example of not outsourcing its top of the line products. As they've just annonced they are moving production from Finland, Mexico and Hungary to China.

bayerische wrote:

Dkatz, from now you can leave out Nokia as an example of not outsourcing its top of the line products. As they've just annonced they are moving production from Finland, Mexico and Hungary to China.

 

 

😉 So only development and marketing left in Finland?

@Dkatz - since everything you mention is hypothetical and idealistic, can I ask if B&O were to open their own factory in China would you then concede that the product produced were real B&O, worthy of the brand?

I ask since it seems its OK to produce anywhere in Europe as long as B&O owns the building.

beocool wrote:

bayerische wrote:

Dkatz, from now you can leave out Nokia as an example of not outsourcing its top of the line products. As they've just annonced they are moving production from Finland, Mexico and Hungary to China.

 

 

 

😉 So only development and marketing left in Finland?

Pretty much. They are moving the manufacturing of phones from Salo to china. Head office is in Espoo. The Salo plant has some 3000 employees, and 1000 of them are getting layed off during 2012.

So what are the rest of the 2000 left going to do? According to Nokia they are about to help customizing phones.... whatever that means.

I'm darn sure, it's a smoke screen to divert attention from the obvious, there will be no more Salo plant soon. Better to take it at an even slash, instead of hitting it hard right away.

Nokia.... a gigantic Dinosaur. We all know what happends to them. 

beocool wrote:

😉 So only development and marketing left in Finland?

Nokia's R&D has been spread out for a long time, particularly at the Networks division which was combined with Siemens.

This downsizing (practically closing down) of the factory is somewhat relevant in this thread, as this Salo establishment can be seen as the spiritual home of the entire mobile communications branch. It started over there as a joint venture between Salora (a TV & radio manufacturer) and Nokia (then making anything from cables to rubber boots to minicomputers) in 1979. Lately, they have been assembling some of the small series higher end models and prototypes. Ever since Mr. Micros Elop managed to kill the smart phone sales at least temporarily last year, the bulk of the operations has been in cheap phones - the components are made in Asia, the markets are in Asia, no sense in shipping stuff back & forth. Even the new plant in Romania (built after closing down Bochum, Germany) has gone.

Those buyers won't give a crap about where the phones are made or don't even know. The African farmer who gets to charge his phone weekly at the town only cares that the phone works for a long time and survives the occasional drop.

BTW, Huawei and ZTE are completely Chinese, and they have a large and growing share in mobile data communications (think 3G modems), and also phones particularly at their local market. I'm sure many of their engineers have received their education for free in Finland.

Also, I can assure John != Jonathan. Moderators can see the IP addresses anyone used for posting, so that trick wouldn't get you very far; it has been previously used a few times in heated topics, though...

EDIT: I guess I need to add that "!=" is programmerspeak for "not equal". Sorry if I fooled you Andreas!

Hmmm.... using two users. That's a bit cheap.

tournedos wrote:

Also, I can assure John != Jonathan

Just so that there's absolutely no confusion ............. the operator "!="  means "is not equal to".

Puncher wrote:

tournedos wrote:

Also, I can assure John != Jonathan

Just so that there's absolutely no confusion ............. the operator "!="  means "is not equal to".

So John is not Jonathan?

That's good to know! 

tournedos wrote:

beocool wrote:

😉 So only development and marketing left in Finland?

Nokia's R&D has been spread out for a long time, particularly at the Networks division which was combined with Siemens.

This downsizing (practically closing down) of the factory is somewhat relevant in this thread, as this Salo establishment can be seen as the spiritual home of the entire mobile communications branch. It started over there as a joint venture between Salora (a TV & radio manufacturer) and Nokia (then making anything from cables to rubber boots to minicomputers) in 1979. Lately, they have been assembling some of the small series higher end models and prototypes. Ever since Mr. Micros Elop managed to kill the smart phone sales at least temporarily last year, the bulk of the operations has been in cheap phones - the components are made in Asia, the markets are in Asia, no sense in shipping stuff back & forth. Even the new plant in Romania (built after closing down Bochum, Germany) has gone.

Those buyers won't give a crap about where the phones are made or don't even know. The African farmer who gets to charge his phone weekly at the town only cares that the phone works for a long time and survives the occasional drop.

BTW, Huawei and ZTE are completely Chinese, and they have a large and growing share in mobile data communications (think 3G modems), and also phones particularly at their local market. I'm sure many of their engineers have received their education for free in Finland.

Also, I can assure John != Jonathan. Moderators can see the IP addresses anyone used for posting, so that trick wouldn't get you very far; it has been previously used a few times in heated topics, though...

EDIT: I guess I need to add that "!=" is programmerspeak for "not equal". Sorry if I fooled you Andreas!

You did! 😂

I thought you had a slip and put in an extra space.

I don't speak "programmer". 😂

Dkatz, sorry, but I don't read your rehashed points.  Hope I didn't miss anything of substance.  Ever notice that most HBR and Sloan business articles are merely trailers for books that simply rehash the core points from the article?  Rest assured I have really thought about the core points you made a long time ago, and know all of your message I need to know (That's right, my need to buy is far more important that your need to sell).

You appear to know how you wish it were, supported by hundreds of microdots of data that you have shaped into a worldview.  If, at 27, you are able to figure the whole thing out then you might consider getting off your tail and actually implementing it.  The world is tough and unreliable for the vast majority and it is only those with huge passion for making things better who force change into the system.  It's a lot easier if you own the organization you want to change, btw.   

So get off the BeoTrain, put on the ruby slippers and start your trek down the yellow brick road.  If you make it to Oz, nobody will be more proud of you than I.   

Otherwise, get a university professor job and write a book or 20.  Check out the 4 C's of effective written communications.