I think Dkatz is struggling to comprehend this, thats why we keep going round in circles! I am sure he will be here in mo, to argue his case even further!!
And will keep writing "my point is....". The point was lost on page 2.
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568 replies
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I would like to see a B&O financial spreadsheet from.... 1996, or 1999, or 1989.
This is when products like the TV's was priced at about twice that of the competitors high-end model. Silly inflation hadn't started.
Obviously the strategy with a 20.000 euro TV didn't work out.
I would like to see a B&O financial spreadsheet from.... 1996, or 1999, or 1989.This is when products like the TV's was priced at about twice that of the competitors high-end model. Silly inflation hadn't started.
Obviously the strategy with a 20.000 euro TV didn't work out.
Bayerische,
As I have tried to point out way, way, down below, I beleive that the affordability of B&O products has roughly stayed about the same between 1980 and today. This is when one assumes a model of official average UK disposable income statistics, versus the corrected price of yester-year products by the average UK Retail Price Index and of those "equivalent" products available today.
The core issue as I see it with respect to sales (aside of the main discussion of whether to "make in China" or not), is that the market place (i.e. the buying public) has preferred to go for cheaper and cheaper products, which are in general more disposable and emphasis on convenience over audio (or visual) excellence. The class of product we now generally buy is iPod/compressed media focused with a 1 to 2 year lifecycle, whereas yester-year, one could argue was all about buying the highest quality product and media which would last 5 to 20 years and still then, in-terms of audio and videophilic properties be cutting-edge.
B&O's problem is/was not because they implemented outrageous product price inflation - far from it, it is because they wanted to be in an upper segment of a mainstream market and failed to recognise that the market was changing for a different class of product.
10
As I have tried to point out way, way, down below, I beleive that the affordability of B&O products has roughly stayed about the same between 1980 and today. This is when one assumes a model of official average UK disposable income statistics, versus the corrected price of yester-year products by the average UK Retail Price Index and of those "equivalent" products available today.
The core issue as I see it with respect to sales (aside of the main discussion of whether to "make in China" or not), is that the market place (i.e. the buying public) has preferred to go for cheaper and cheaper products, which are in general more disposable and emphasis on convenience over audio (or visual) excellence. The class of product we now generally buy is iPod/compressed media focused with a 1 to 2 year lifecycle, whereas yester-year, one could argue was all about buying the highest quality product and media which would last 5 to 20 years and still then, in-terms of audio and videophilic properties be cutting-edge.
B&O's problem is/was not because they implemented outrageous product price inflation - far from it, it is because they wanted to be in an upper segment of a mainstream market and failed to recognise that the market was changing for a different class of product.
10
Correct 10%, well said.
I would like to see a B&O financial spreadsheet from.... 1996, or 1999, or 1989.This is when products like the TV's was priced at about twice that of the competitors high-end model. Silly inflation hadn't started.
Obviously the strategy with a 20.000 euro TV didn't work out.
Bayerische,
As I have tried to point out way, way, down below, I beleive that the affordability of B&O products has roughly stayed about the same between 1980 and today. This is when one assumes a model of official average UK disposable income statistics, versus the corrected price of yester-year products by the average UK Retail Price Index and of those "equivalent" products available today.
The core issue as I see it with respect to sales (aside of the main discussion of whether to "make in China" or not), is that the market place (i.e. the buying public) has preferred to go for cheaper and cheaper products, which are in general more disposable and emphasis on convenience over audio (or visual) excellence. The class of product we now generally buy is iPod/compressed media focused with a 1 to 2 year lifecycle, whereas yester-year, one could argue was all about buying the highest quality product and media which would last 5 to 20 years and still then, in-terms of audio and videophilic properties be cutting-edge.
B&O's problem is/was not because they implemented outrageous product price inflation - far from it, it is because they wanted to be in an upper segment of a mainstream market and failed to recognise that the market was changing for a different class of product.
10
Not sure I entirely agree with this, firstly disposable income is post tax but doesn't take into account fixed monthly outgoings such as mortages, fuel, food, VAT etc. Secondly, regardless of the percentages you quote, B&O did lose control of their prices as I believe the following graph clearly shows. Falling sales as the credit crunch bit, have resulted in escalating prices from 2007 onward - clearly a worrying trend that cannot continue indefinitely.
Shown here are the UK prices of the BS9000, BL6000 & BL8000 during their years of production -
Not sure I entirely agree with this, firstly disposable income is post tax but doesn't take into account fixed monthly outgoings such as mortages, fuel, food, VAT etc.
Maybe not, but that is a personal choice isnt it? Further, looking at personal taxation for a UK individual, one could argue from 1980 to 2012, there has been a massive inflationary rise in that period, thus significantly lowering the % of disposable income to pre-tax earnings.
The methodology presented is clear and can be corroborated by anyone if they so wish. A simple price graph of a few B&O products is only one peice in a rather complicated jigsaw of the truth.
A simple price graph of a few B&O products is only one peice in a rather complicated jigsaw of the truth.
It may well be, but it clearly highlights the issue at hand - products aren't selling and prices are increasing.
20% loss of currency value to Euro over that period does not help, but I guess(?) you can manage some of that by trading within the EuroZone?
20% loss of currency value to Euro over that period does not help
True, it would be interesting to see the same data for the Danish & German markets.
It may well be, but it clearly highlights the issue at hand - products aren't selling and prices are increasing.
Yes Puncher. They are. But other things are also changing:-
Personal taxation, indirect taxation, salaries, mortgages, commodities etc.... certain things that people buy are also getting cheaper. However you have to try integrate them all together the best you can. GBP10 today will not buy the same as GBP10 years ago. That is why you cannot simple post a graph of B&O prices and say they are getting more expensive without a more detailed context.
10
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