Dkatz: I think you live in another world, one with unicorns and fairies and everybody hugging each other...

The rest of us live in the real world!!! Surely enough has been said on this topic!!

Dkatz for President! 🤒

B&O, show us your China factory! Show us the working conditions there!🤔

alenvprekrsku wrote:

B&O, show us your China factory! Show us the working conditions there!🤔

Surely that's for the Chinese to figure out? Since when have us Westerners become judge and jury on how other countries sort out their lives? I don't want to point any fingers, but your Western life hasn't always been this way. You have very short-term memories. I'm sure Slovenia has had a turbulent past.

In the UK, as an example, it wasn't long ago we had workhouses (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Workhouse). Dreadful conditions for many. But workers rose up and sorted out their lives. It took time, but it happened. Even in the 70s, unions were up in arms about their workers. Strikes galore. Now, really, are we in a position here in the UK? Has everything "improved" for the better? There are about a million (!) youth unemployed. Why aren't they in the factories? That's right, there aren't any as we all rose up and wanted a better standard of living! Oh the irony.

I do love the way Westerners live in their ivory towers, surrounded by their luxury B&O kit, telling other countries how they should be living their lives. We invade, we overrule, we talk about working conditions, yet conveniently forget our own history.

China will change, it will have the world's biggest economy in years to come. Consumerism has and will change everyone's lives (as it in in the States), workers will want more from their life and factories will move to other, more developing, countries. That's how it's always been. These places just move around the globe.

But it's not up to American's or any Western person to sit there and say their way of life is right - there are plenty of things wrong about most countries, including the UK. And it's going to get a lot worse soon. If the Euro collapses, I wouldn't be worrying about the working life of the Chinese...

Consider a small Chinese electronic assembly as an example, costing $6. Materials account for ~$4.50, meaning  ~$1.50 is for labour etc. Assuming this is paid at Dkatz's $1.65 rate, then adjusted for $25 and $55 rates this assembly would then cost from $27.23 - $54.50.

The company is out of business at a stroke!

Jonathan wrote:

Dkatz: I think you live in another world, one with unicorns and fairies and everybody hugging each other...

The rest of us live in the real world!!! Surely enough has been said on this topic!!

I for one agree!

This thread is going nowhere, and I really do not understand beating down the BeoSound 8 quality-wise, be it sound or build. Amazing product for a reasonable price!

About outsourcing, in this case done by Apple to China, I can see why they cannot produce quality products:

http://www.apple.com/supplierresponsibility/

Conditions and standards are horrific! How dare they!

Since all outsourcing to China (or other "cheap" countries) is considered a no-no, which leads to bad quality, I suppose B&O -- a smaller company than Apple -- not known for its attentention to detail, material standards and level of craftmanship, has things much, much worse over there :(

/sarcasm

moxxey wrote:

I do love the way Westerners live in their ivory towers.....We invade, we overrule, we talk about working conditions, yet conveniently forget our own history.

Indeed moxxey - I said something very similar way back on Page 2.

The West is in for a rude wake up call, imo - with a pincer movement of pressure - one one side from the developing countries who aspire to a "western" lifestyle, whilst on the other that very lifestyle is exposed as a self-financed, remortgaged, over-leveraged house of cards built on shifting sands.

There is a fine song called The Grand Correction by UK singer Chris Wood - I fear it is very true.

[View:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Vxy68ssdo0]

And here's one for anyone who thinks dealing in property is anything other than stealing from future generations

[View:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8vtxmfI61dY&feature=related]

KMA wrote:

Conditions and standards are horrific! How dare they!

See the middle-England Daily Mail and their current headline: link. And my favourite photo from this article: http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/01/26/article-2092277-11744962000005DC-6_634x423.jpg

But middle Englanders are quick to judge. We need to allow the Chinese to sort themselves out, embrace Facebook, enjoy a Starbucks, learn to love X-Factor, worship at the alter of an Apple Store, eat at McDonalds and figure what they are missing from their lives, without our interjection.

moxxey wrote:

 We need to allow the Chinese to sort themselves out, embrace Facebook, enjoy a Starbucks, learn to love X-Factor, worship at the alter of an Apple Store, eat at McDonalds and figure what they are missing from their lives, without our interjection.

Darn...there was me thinking i'm English.....when afterall I'm actually Chinese!

I just found this article, which is slightly related to outsourcing, logistics, mass production, A***e, and especially design - it challenges the length of Dkatz's writings, and as a breath of fresh air to this discussion, actually mentions Bang & Olufsen 😁