I would add one more item about the technical abilities of the Chinese.  China is only the third country in the world to have a manned space program after the US and Russia. They are planning to have a small manned space station in orbit within the next two years and plan to be on the moon by 2020.  These are significant technical achievements.  China should not be dismissed as the land of low paid workers who produce cheap goods.

We bought our first house in 1982 for £11500 (a terrraced doer-upper), a year later I bought my MX2000 for approx. £540. This was very reasonable compared to the competition at about £350. That house too is now worth ~£180,000. If TV's prices increased at the same rate as houses why aren't run of the mill 20inch Sony TV's now £5,500?

My conclusion would be that consumer electronics prices and house prices are not related.

I was a junior Engineer when I bought the TV and my BS5000 system i.e. not wealthy at all.

Puncher wrote:

My conclusion would be that consumer electronics prices and house prices are not related.

 

Amen!

Puncher wrote:

My conclusion would be that consumer electronics prices and house prices are not related.

 

Amen!

bayerische wrote:

Puncher wrote:

My conclusion would be that consumer electronics prices and house prices are not related.

 

Amen!

Can't this thread grind to a halt? It's a discussion going no-where. We have people saying the Chinese can't produce quality, but who the hell cares? The proof is in the pudding and the pudding is damned good - the Chinese BS8 and Beolit 12 are great.

Miele may produce their washing machines in Germany, but I can also tell you that Miele purchasers I know say that recent Miele products are not a patch on old Miele products, which were built like tanks. Even Miele are finding ways to cut costs, like all manufacturers.

I've never seen a discussion before, at such length, where the argument is over successful products. How on earth can any create an argument around this?

People here are putting out daft arguments about quality of manufacturing.....as if the BS8/Beolit 12 were failures and the reason was due to the manufacturing! Weird, just weird.

moxxey,  You are probably correct.  This discussion should end.  I've had my Beolit 12 since this past Wednesday and am very impressed. Unfortunately for me my wife likes it too.  I going to have to buy another Beolit 12 for her.

@Bentleyman - I see what you are saying about the very early tube TV relative to income ( although i was using the MX era sets as an exampe) but I don't agree with your calculations, because house prices have also changed relative to income over the years.

As Puncher has pointed out house price infaltion in the UK has distorted the comparison to make it meaningless ( this is also a whole other discussion, about how 30 years of artificial boom has landed the next few generations with a huge problem - not to mention the fact the average first time buyer in 2012 will be 37 - so the "standard" mortgage term of 25 years will into retirement for many !!!)

Plus,  TV was an emerging, very expensive technology when your mother bought her house  - and they were very cheap then.  So you are not using a valid example.  The audio systems of the 60's would be a better guide - ie, established technologies with established distribution and easily available.

The original Beolit radio's were not beyond the means of Joe Public. 

Neither were the Beograms and "classic" audio systems that are still popular with collectors, and restored/refurbished by the likes of Frede.

Neither were TV's during the LX/MX era - spanning nearly 30 years.

So, your points notwithstanding,  I just don't accept that B&O have betrayed their heritage, or are in danger of doing so. 

Puncher wrote:

My conclusion would be that consumer electronics prices and house prices are not related.

Sure, I can accept and agree with this. Fair point.

Could you suggest something that is relatable/comparable so we can have a closer comparable example.

What about the net monthly salary comparison between 1968 and pesent day for example?

Or how about comparing the 1968 list price of a car with an equivalent today...? Say an E-type Jaguar in 1968 against a 2012 XK for instance?

My point is this : say I work in a supermarket and my take home is £1,200 per month. If I want a B&O BS8 or Beolit12 I could afford one from a single months pay, and still have quite a bit of change.

My £1,200 per month today would have been the equivalent of about £40 in 1968. If I wanted to buy a Beolit 1000 in 1969 this would have cost £64 + 15 shillings - therefore more than 1.5 months of my pay. So, yes, consumer electronics have generally come down in reletive prices and affordability - good news for all consumers both rich and poor

🙂 Happy days. We never had it so good 👍

Actually Moxxey, I think the BS8 is terrible! Its sound quality does not involve or invite. I think it's horrible and im convinced in years to come, this forum will say avoid stuff like this.

Its no more than a £300 product with a B&O badge, out sourced in China to appeal to B&O's existing rich customers who simply do not know any better!

moxxey wrote:

Can't this thread grind to a halt? It's a discussion going no-where. We have people saying the Chinese can't produce quality, but who the hell cares?

The thread/discussion will end when no-one wishes to add any more to it - not, with all due respect, when moxxey decides it should grind to a halt.

moxxey wrote:

I've never seen a discussion before, at such length, where the argument is over successful products. How on earth can any create an argument around this?

 ........so why do you keep adding your opinions to it, thereby fueling the debate/discussion/argument then..?