bandoboy wrote:

It also hurts when we read on these forums (yes B&O staff read them too!) how much many people don;t like a particular product before they've even seen it.

I'm sorry, but I disagree with this. The majority of these comments come from users - like me - who own these problematic products. If you think the Beosound 5 is a 'fantastic' product, that's just an objective opinion. Many others, including people who own it, think it's flawed. More from a software perspective, than a design/hardware viewpoint.

If B&O bothered to interact with us customers, we wouldn't have to discuss these issues with the B&O sales staff. Sadly it's the way B&O is now setup - they want us to deal directly with the store and the staff.

Do I ask you to feel sorry for me? :)

I am delighted to hear that more B&O employees and sales staff are reading Beoworld.  I would hope you are able to convey input to management that some products need extra attention.

I have a Beosound 5 and really like it but there are lingering problems especially for Mac users.  I use my Beosound 5 more than my Beocenter 2 mostly because of the internet radio and to a lesser extent for playing ripped CDs.  However if I had to do it all over, I would not have bought the Beosound 5 until a few problems are resolved.  Beosound 5 does not properly sort multiple CD albums.  I no longer rip multiple CD albums.  To my amazement, it is apparent B&O did not check the market for this product properly and therefore did not know there would be a lot of Mac users.  As a proficient Mac user, Beosound 5 is a pain to use.  I have an iTunes library of over 500 CDs ripped in Apple Lossless format which of course will not play on Beosound 5.  I have converted many of the files to 320 AAC and it works.  Thinking that maybe I should rip CDs to Beosound 5 using Windows lossless to get higher quality, I loaded Windows XP using VM Fusion on my Mac.  What a pain to use?  It requires time and diligence to use.  The user manual for Beosound 5 is terrible!  I could go on.

I am sympathetic to anyone's economic plight, but as a customer I need some sympathy too.

@linder: 
I had the same sorting problem on my Beosound 5. There's a simple trick: Every CD you rip (or file you edit) must(!) be tagged as a compilation CD!
As you're using a Mac, too it shouldn't be a problem as it is only one small checkbox in iTunes.

I've installed Windows XP Pro and the Windows Media Player 11, too for ripping in WMA losless (which is a professional high quality format). It's a shame that this codec is not available on the Mac as I could easy convert my WAV-files to WMA-losless. But now I have to re-rip my CDs with Windows Media Player.



The overall quality of the B&O products seem to cease, especialy in terms of software quality and reliability. I had 2 weeks of fun with my Beosound 5 and since then it started to go wild ... now I contacted my dealer to find a solution or replace it.

Hopefully in Denmark they learn that their stuff should be "Made in Denmark" (yes, I insist on this) like the older Avant etc. This where the real "wow" products that impress due to their quality etc.
Outsourcing to China or Czech etc. is only a sign that B&O want to get greedy and this is the absolutely wrong way! 


@bandoboy:
I can imagine how you feel because I thought the same about B&O before having the first live contact with their products and good sale staff!
I thought it was just an expensive design toy, not worth the money. Then I saw that most of their products seem to be made in their home country which is very positive and I touched, watched and listened to their products.
My first love was a Beosound 3000 with Beolab 6000 and the Beo 4. I was impressed  by the sound of such small speakers, I love the sliding real glass doors (no plastic) and when touching the Beo 4 remote I thought to myself "Oh, I can defense myself with this thing!".
In short: I loved it.
What realy helped me was the very polite B&O sale person in my favorite B&O store. He was not conceited  or condescending like I experienced  it in other stores (and btw I can't understand such behaviour as the sales person couldn't see if your bank account counts 100.000 or 1000.000.000 Euro).  I had problems (currently the Beosound 5) with my B&O equipment and if the sales person wasn't that attentive and helpful, I think I would have thrown some of the equipment through the closed windows 😁
I buy "gadgets" for playing and have fun and I buy B&O to simply use and enjoy it. And for the B&O price I insist on full and correct functionality and not an overpriced Made in China peace like a famous american company ... ;-)

I know that you guys sometimes must have a hard job but I think it is worth it if you can see the smiling faces of customers like me when they leave your store in a very good mood with a new "toy" 🙂 

TWG wrote:

@linder: 
I had the same sorting problem on my Beosound 5. There's a simple trick: Every CD you rip (or file you edit) must(!) be tagged as a compilation CD!
As you're using a Mac, too it shouldn't be a problem as it is only one small checkbox in iTunes.

I've installed Windows XP Pro and the Windows Media Player 11, too for ripping in WMA losless (which is a professional high quality format). It's a shame that this codec is not available on the Mac as I could easy convert my WAV-files to WMA-losless. But now I have to re-rip my CDs with Windows Media Player.

TWG,  Thanks for the tip.

I have been thinking about returning my Beosound 5 to the dealer also but will probably keep it.  This experience will definitely influence my future purchase decisions for B&O products.

Dear bandoboy,

I might sound a bit harsh, but … stop moaning – for your own good. There is no one to help you, least so the media industry, but yourself (and the BeoWorld, of course! 😁)

That something is “too expensive” and never “perfect” is/should be a standard input from ANY buyer in general, recession or no recession… And there are much tougher “sales situation” than yours: usually they range between two extremes where on the one hand you don’t sell unless you bribe the buyer, and on the other hand when even a bribe will not help as no one wants the product… How about that? There are also products that practically sell themselves (for some time), of course, but most stable/established companies with their product portfolios are on a daily basis somewhere in between, in a relative “comfort” zone, ie to make a legitimate very hard effort to actually sell and make profit is needed.

Regarding the customers, it seems to me that you are a bit scared of them, perhaps? Don’t worry, they are just people as you and me. Some buyers could present to you a detailed analysis as to why your price is too high (and as they are - per definition – informed and some very clever in addition, they will usually get you to accept a price that is, well, acceptable for both of you), others will feel just great being entirely “in your hands”, yet others will be just tire-kickers etc. – all of the above combined with the usual and unusual human characters. (You have surely noticed the diversity of views – wrongly or rightly from bashing to praise - here on BeoWorld.) You can’t change this/them and the only thing you can do is to try and understand better who is who and what they want.

There is no need to get demoralized: Learn continuously about the company and the people who make the products you sell, and (not least) about the customers as much as you can. This combined with your love (though I would  prefer to use passion instead) for what you sell should keep you ahead of the game with such products as B&O’s. Luckily, you might realize that what’s in it for you is enough – and I don’t mean strictly money.

Head up and happy expanding your customers portfolio (in several dimensions) – because that’s the key! Information is crucial but it needs to be handled with care … er, BeoCare

😁

Bandoboy,

Don't expect any sympathy from this lot! Asking a BeoWorlder to say something nice about a Bang & Olufsen product built after 1990 is a fools errand!

Seriously though, I'm a store owner and if I heard you moping about like this I'd tell you to man the eff up. We're a world class luxury goods manufacturer that builds some of the most desirable and satisfying products in the entire world and if comments from a few sour pusses are getting to you then crawl back into the womb. Not being able to sell Bang & Olufsen is like not being able to sell ice cream! Sure it's expensive, but for our demographic (which is woefully underrepresented on this site) we are literally the only solution there is. Period.

Look for Affineur's posts. He is probably the only poster that represents our clientele's thinking and lifestyle and his perspective is truly valuable for anyone who wants insight into who is really out there buying Bang & Olufsen and why. There is simply nothing else as well built, emotionally vibrant, and elegantly operated as our equipment.

From your post it sounds like you're in one of the more geographically precarious Bang & Olufsens here on the East Coast. While I understand that it can seem like a cruel parade of nitwits balking at price tags, that's more your perception than objective reality and likely (at least partially) a result of your demeanor. Americans are not predisposed to luxury, but aren't totally baffled by it when presented enthusiastically and confidently. Luxury by its nature is about going beyond adequate to appeal to a very personal and irrational need. The feeling of a Wustof in your hand, the way a Borelli shirt feels when its sewn just for you, or the way an Ellsworth Kelly looks hanging in your living room simply don't have objective value propositions. They are luxuries and no $20 knife, $50 shirt, or $90 framed print from the MoMA can come anywhere near the real thing.

If you can represent our brand and our values as the best of us do, the curmudgeons and crybabies in life and online will seem far less daunting. 

TripEnglish wrote:

Bandoboy,

Don't expect any sympathy from this lot! Asking a BeoWorlder to say something nice about a Bang & Olufsen product built after 1990 is a fools errand!

Seriously though, I'm a store owner and if I heard you moping about like this I'd tell you to man the eff up. We're a world class luxury goods manufacturer that builds some of the most desirable and satisfying products in the entire world and if comments from a few sour pusses are getting to you then crawl back into the womb. Not being able to sell Bang & Olufsen is like not being able to sell ice cream! Sure it's expensive, but for our demographic (which is woefully underrepresented on this site) we are literally the only solution there is. Period.

Look for Affineur's posts. He is probably the only poster that represents our clientele's thinking and lifestyle and his perspective is truly valuable for anyone who wants insight into who is really out there buying Bang & Olufsen and why. There is simply nothing else as well built, emotionally vibrant, and elegantly operated as our equipment.

From your post it sounds like you're in one of the more geographically precarious Bang & Olufsens here on the East Coast. While I understand that it can seem like a cruel parade of nitwits balking at price tags, that's more your perception than objective reality and likely (at least partially) a result of your demeanor. Americans are not predisposed to luxury, but aren't totally baffled by it when presented enthusiastically and confidently. Luxury by its nature is about going beyond adequate to appeal to a very personal and irrational need. The feeling of a Wustof in your hand, the way a Borelli shirt feels when its sewn just for you, or the way an Ellsworth Kelly looks hanging in your living room simply don't have objective value propositions. They are luxuries and no $20 knife, $50 shirt, or $90 framed print from the MoMA can come anywhere near the real thing.

If you can represent our brand and our values as the best of us do, the curmudgeons and crybabies in life and online will seem far less daunting. 

You are kidding?

TripEnglish wrote:

Bandoboy,

Don't expect any sympathy from this lot! Asking a BeoWorlder to say something nice about a Bang & Olufsen product built after 1990 is a fools errand!

Seriously though, I'm a store owner and if I heard you moping about like this I'd tell you to man the eff up. We're a world class luxury goods manufacturer that builds some of the most desirable and satisfying products in the entire world and if comments from a few sour pusses are getting to you then crawl back into the womb. Not being able to sell Bang & Olufsen is like not being able to sell ice cream! Sure it's expensive, but for our demographic (which is woefully underrepresented on this site) we are literally the only solution there is. Period.

Look for Affineur's posts. He is probably the only poster that represents our clientele's thinking and lifestyle and his perspective is truly valuable for anyone who wants insight into who is really out there buying Bang & Olufsen and why. There is simply nothing else as well built, emotionally vibrant, and elegantly operated as our equipment.

From your post it sounds like you're in one of the more geographically precarious Bang & Olufsens here on the East Coast. While I understand that it can seem like a cruel parade of nitwits balking at price tags, that's more your perception than objective reality and likely (at least partially) a result of your demeanor. Americans are not predisposed to luxury, but aren't totally baffled by it when presented enthusiastically and confidently. Luxury by its nature is about going beyond adequate to appeal to a very personal and irrational need. The feeling of a Wustof in your hand, the way a Borelli shirt feels when its sewn just for you, or the way an Ellsworth Kelly looks hanging in your living room simply don't have objective value propositions. They are luxuries and no $20 knife, $50 shirt, or $90 framed print from the MoMA can come anywhere near the real thing.

If you can represent our brand and our values as the best of us do, the curmudgeons and crybabies in life and online will seem far less daunting. 

Stunned silence.

How to win friends & influence people isn't your favourite saying then Trip? Maybe try looking a little closer to home as to why B&O is recently failing.

Maybe B&O should move into Ostrich farming, I've heard there's good money to be made and they're famous for burying their heads in the sand - a match made in heaven?

 Don't get me wrong though, I really want B&O to succeed but at least 90% the current range of products are absolute pants and I wouldn't have them near me. There's a perfectly good reason why most Beoworlders seem to prefer the pre 1990's stuff - IT WORKS as it should!! Don't even bother using the build quality argument on me, if I bought a Rolls Royce I would expect the same quality but with a Rolls Royce engine under the bonnet & not something nicked from a Skoda and here is where B&O's current problems well & truly lie.

Chris.