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BeogramCD6500 adjustment issues

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ALF
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ALF posted on Sun, Sep 17 2017 3:57 AM

hi all,

A non-performing CD6500 thanks to a dishonest seller !!

loading a disc is fine, press play and the disc rotates briefly and stops after a few seconds after trying

to read the track inventory.

put the player in the service position, trying to adjust the focus offset: 2 is blinking on the display but I am unable to get it steady via trimmer 30R3146 - has no impact whatsoever ?

I replaced 30R 2138,2140, 2103, 2104, 2107.

I also checked all flat- connectors on and from PCB30 - all fine as well as the voltages on Plug33 and 36.

Can I improve the situation if the main caps on PCB5 would be replaced or can I assume the laser is dead ?

will be very greatful for some pointers/help 🤔🤔

ALF

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Dillen
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Dillen replied on Sun, Sep 17 2017 8:12 AM

DON'T adjust anything !!!
The adjustments are factory set and nothing of that has changed or needs changing.

C2103 MUST be a blue Philips axial (or one of very few other closely related types).
It will perform just as you describe if you fit any and all other brand/type of capacitor.

Martin

ALF
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ALF replied on Sun, Sep 17 2017 10:32 AM

Thank you Martin,

Well, the uF-caps on the servo board where all pretty much out of spec, hence their replacement.

the famous blue axial Philips cap had about 21uF left instead of the specified 33uF !

the adjustment procedure is as per service manual as you will know -

I do not wildly adjust trimmers without marking where I started from, just in case !

but it did not work out anyhow - the "2" in the display just keeps blinking - that is where I stopped.

you mentioned to replace that blue axial Philips with the same  or closely related typ: any suggestion in particular would be most helpful.

would just be wonderful if that fixes the problem ?!

ALF

solderon29
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Worst case scenario is that the laser has died,but this is unusual.

As Martin states,C2103 is crucial,and the original Philips type cap is now remarketed as Vishay(BC Components)No MAL20305339E3.If you run a web search locally,you should be able to find a supplier,or I can send you one.

Also,have a close look at the ribbon cable that connects the servo board to the transport mech and laser.

The focus coils connection can become burnt and o/c at the servo board connection.The ribbon can also become o/c where it has to bend with the movement of the tray.There are other ribbon connections under the mech too,that can be troublesome.

Follow the instructions in the manual to set the laser current preset to it's "datum" point,by measuring it's resistance,the actual current can be set if and when the machine is running.

Nice machine,all B&O designed  apart from the Philips servo and optics.

Regards,

Nick

ALF
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ALF replied on Mon, Sep 18 2017 4:51 AM

Thanks Nick for your contribution, much appreciated 🤗

Thank you for your kind offer regarding that critical blue Philips cap - I was able to order some of that type.

it surely can't be just the brand what is important here but the spec being 33uF -10/+50% ?!

There have been many discussions about 'laser death' and in many cases itbis NOT the laser that has died but other sources.

in that respect I am quietly confident that this laser is still ok ?!

From memory, when the laser swings in to atempt reading there should be a 'focus movement' 

with the lense moving up and down, trying to focus ?? I can not see any up or down movement here ?

I was also looking at the focus motor amplifier - IC 6104 on the servo board ? Can this be ruled out as causing trouble ?

such a lovely machine has to come back to life !!

ALF

Weebyx
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Weebyx replied on Mon, Sep 18 2017 6:18 AM

ALF:

From memory, when the laser swings in to atempt reading there should be a 'focus movement' 

with the lense moving up and down, trying to focus ?? I can not see any up or down movement here ?

I was also looking at the focus motor amplifier - IC 6104 on the servo board ? Can this be ruled out as causing trouble ?

such a lovely machine has to come back to life !!

ALF

Yes, normally the laser will try to focus, so if that does not work, maybe there is something worse wrong, other than the "usual". Did you measure if there are focus voltage, or that there is connection from the PCB board through the cable and to the laser ?

Maybe you can source some parts from old 35/4500/85/9500 units, they use almost the same laser PCB as the 65/7000 series.

 

/Jacob

 

Dillen
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Dillen replied on Mon, Sep 18 2017 6:36 AM

ALF:

 

it surely can't be just the brand what is important here but the spec being 33uF -10/+50% ?!

 

 

No.

The important thing is its HF filtering properties (capacitive reactance etc.).

Note that this component is the only one of its type on the board. All others are either radials or SMDs.

It was chosen for a reason.

 

And the range of the laser current trimmer is (sadly) wide enough to easily burn the laser if you work "blindfolded".

All it takes is one uncontrolled turn of the trimmer. 2/10th of a second at a too high setting and the

laser goes dark forever.

- And the laser is actually powered even if it doesn't read due to lack of filtering (because of C2103).

Many lasers died because "repairers" thought it was dying and cranked up its power in panic.

 

Replace the capacitors on the servo board and DON'T touch any adjustments. 

 

Martin

solderon29
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The lack of focus coil movement is significant!

You can check the continuity of the focus coil at the servo board by metering across pin 13 and 14 of connector 31(the ribbon).It should read about 25ohm.If not,it suggests that the ribbon cable is o/c somewhere.I've never come across a o/c focus coil,but the ribbon and it's connectors can fail..

It's worth checking the laser current preset datum setting if you suspect that the machine has been interfered with previously.Measuring between pin 15 and16 of IC6101(TDA5708) should read about 550ohm.If it's thereabouts,don't touch the preset..

The mechanism in the CD55/65/7000 machines is unique to them,although the actual Rafoc assembly (coils and laser) can be found in other machines,although there were a lot of revisions,so these assemblies are not allway's swappable.

Good luck with it.

Nick

Weebyx
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Weebyx replied on Mon, Sep 18 2017 10:09 AM

solderon29:

The mechanism in the CD55/65/7000 machines is unique to them,although the actual Rafoc assembly (coils and laser) can be found in other machines,although there were a lot of revisions,so these assemblies are not allway's swappable.

Good luck with it.

Nick

I didn't meant as a "swapover", just that parts and IC's could be swapped if an IC was dead :) There is very little difference on the PCB between a 6500 and 35/4500 :) Mostly some transistors around the supply at the top of the board :)

/Weebyx

solderon29
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Indeed sir.I wasn't being critical!

This does'nt seem to be a servo board problem,other than the question of the notorious C2103?

I was thinking more of possibly having to swap the rafoc assembly.

Regards,

Nick

ALF
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ALF replied on Tue, Sep 19 2017 10:28 AM

Hi Nick,

well, I did not touch any adjustment trimmers !

Loaded a CD, play activated

I can measure about 26ohm across pin 13&14 at connector 31 and between 545-560 ohm across pin 15&16 at IC 6101.

the strange thing is the disc kept on spinning while measuring at IC6101 and I could see the number of tracks on the display as per TOC

the moment I removed the probes the disc stopped again ?

as posted earlier I replaced the uF capacitors on the servo board, including that critical blue Philips axial cap  - but not with the same type, I am waiting

for the shipment to correct the replacement.

I wonder if I should also incude all those nF capacitors as well ??

cheers

ALF

 

Weebyx
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Weebyx replied on Tue, Sep 19 2017 11:26 AM

ALF:

Hi Nick,

well, I did not touch any adjustment trimmers !

Loaded a CD, play activated

I can measure about 26ohm across pin 13&14 at connector 31 and between 545-560 ohm across pin 15&16 at IC 6101.

the strange thing is the disc kept on spinning while measuring at IC6101 and I could see the number of tracks on the display as per TOC

the moment I removed the probes the disc stopped again ?

as posted earlier I replaced the uF capacitors on the servo board, including that critical blue Philips axial cap  - but not with the same type, I am waiting

for the shipment to correct the replacement.

I wonder if I should also incude all those nF capacitors as well ??

cheers

ALF

 

I would hold all further debugging as long as C2103 is not of the correct type..

/Jacob

ALF
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ALF replied on Tue, Sep 19 2017 1:49 PM

Thanks for the advice Jacob,

that is exactly the plan for now !

ALF

Dillen
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Dillen replied on Tue, Sep 19 2017 3:12 PM

You cannot measure Ohms in a powered circuit.

Martin

ALF
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ALF replied on Wed, Sep 20 2017 1:51 AM

Thanks Martin ......

how embarrassing.... Silly me, of course, the  DMM applies voltage in order to measure resistance !!

it is just coincidence that I had a reading consistant with what Nick suggested I should be seing ?!

anyhow, still waiting for that famous blue Philips capacitor to arrive.

Will report back !

ALF

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